AAGPBL - Lois Youngen & Sue Zipay - bringing back the "League of Their Own"

AAGPBL – Sue Zipay & Lois Youngen on BaseballBiz On Deck Transcript

[00:00:00] Mark Corbett: Well, I'm from Kentucky, so that's easy. 

[00:00:04] Lois Youngen: Well, I'm from Ohio, so there. 

[00:00:09] Mark Corbett: Okay, here we get started here. Welcome to baseball biz on deck. I'm Mark Carpenter, your host. And with me today, I have two wonderful women who are going to share the story of the all American girls professional baseball league, what it meant to them, you know, their journey through that and what's coming with the future as well.

[00:00:27] Mark Corbett: I have Ms. Susan Zipay and Lois Youngin. So thank you both for being with us today. 

[00:00:35] Lois Youngen: Thank you for having us. 

[00:00:39] Mark Corbett: Oh my gosh, so much is going on. You know, the way my interest got started with all this is years ago, like a lot of folks. First real introduction was watching a league of their own.

[00:00:50] Mark Corbett: And. That's that is that, did that really happen? Was that for real? You know, I was, I was born in 1956. So at the end, I guess of, of, uh, everything going on with all of the bleep, the league, but man, that was just so vibrant and to find out as they got to the end of the film, they're showing, you know, some women.

[00:01:10] Mark Corbett: And that, you know, you are you guys, I guess, but, uh, not actually making a connection, but kind of alluding to that, these are the women who were in the film. Uh, the depicting, but those were actually fictional characters, but kind of based on what you all did. Is that, is that accurate? 

[00:01:27] Sue Zipay Parsons: Yes, I think so. 

[00:01:28] Mark Corbett: Okay.

[00:01:30] Mark Corbett: Well, good. Oh my. 

[00:01:32] Lois Youngen: Lois, you interrupted me if you disagree. I, I, I'm going to tell the gentleman, Mark, that the movie was about 75 percent accurate. The other 25 percent is what I call Hollywood hyperbole. And we needed that 25%. So, uh, we're, we're not upset about the few little risque kinds of scenes 

[00:02:01] Mark Corbett: and a little flavor drop.

[00:02:02] Mark Corbett: You more eyeballs. 

[00:02:03] Lois Youngen: Absolutely. 

[00:02:04] Mark Corbett: Oh, I love it. Oh my gosh. Well, I can't imagine what that would be like. Uh, Lois, what, what year did you actually come into the league? 

[00:02:12] Lois Youngen: I came into the league in 1951 and I played through 1954. 

[00:02:18] Mark Corbett: Wow. 

[00:02:21] Lois Youngen: Well, I was just going to say I played for the Fort Wayne Daisies and the South Bend Blue Sox.

[00:02:27] Lois Youngen: Those are my only really two teams. You probably would like to know that my first manager in 1951 with the Fort Wayne Daisies was Max Carey, Baseball Hall of Famer. 

[00:02:41] Mark Corbett: Right. 

[00:02:41] Lois Youngen: In 1952, it was the slugger, the great XX Jimmy Foxx. 

[00:02:47] Mark Corbett: Oh, my gosh, 

[00:02:48] Lois Youngen: you only managed one summer, and I was fortunate enough to get to know him.

[00:02:55] Lois Youngen: So I might as well go ahead with my Jimmy Foxx. All right, 

[00:02:58] Mark Corbett: please do. 

[00:03:00] Lois Youngen: Well, in the movie, since we brought up the movie, if you had been a reviewing the film when it came out in 1992, you would have read that the Jimmy Dugan character played by Tom Hanks was a thinly veiled Jimmy Foxxx. 

[00:03:19] Mark Corbett: Oh, wow. 

[00:03:20] Lois Youngen: In other words, Jimmy Foxxx was a falling down drunk in the movie.

[00:03:27] Lois Youngen: Obviously, having played for him, I can tell you he was not a falling down drunk. He was, however, an alcoholic and that was well known. If you remember your personal health 101, you will know that there are functioning alcoholics that do well day to day. And he fell into that category. So he never missed a game.

[00:03:52] Lois Youngen: He never drank on the bus. He never missed the bus. He always tipped his hat and he certainly never yelled, there's no crying in baseball. in front of a large group of fans. Uh, we adored him actually. I can't think of anyone that played for him in 1952 that didn't think he was just about one of the nicest men they had ever met.

[00:04:16] Mark Corbett: Wow. Well, Lois, how did, how did you get started? I mean, uh, you had to have a personal interest in the game long before you made it to the league. How did that connection start? 

[00:04:28] Lois Youngen: Well, my dad was a pretty fair baseball player himself and played in college and pitched, but He really didn't spend a lot of time playing ball with me.

[00:04:39] Lois Youngen: Everybody thinks he did, but he didn't. What happened was we lived in a small rural town, and the houses were on one side of the street, and there was pasture field on the other side, and there were only boys in the neighborhood. So there's no television. Remember? Oh, this is this is the 1940s. And my mother said, you can't read all the time and kick me out of the house.

[00:05:07] Lois Youngen: And all of a sudden, I found out I had athletic ability that I didn't know I had. So the boys said, well, since I was the only girl. Uh, we'll let you play, but you have to either choose between right field or catching. Being smarter than the boys, I said, I'll catch. So, that's how I became a catcher. And that's how I honed my skills, I guess, playing with the boys.

[00:05:37] Mark Corbett: I gotta tell you, Lois, I respect catchers more than anything else. I mean, today I had the opportunity to speak in front of the boys and girls club out in Tampa, and I always ask the kids there, you know, what those are playing, what are, what road do you play? What position? And the young man says, catcher.

[00:05:53] Mark Corbett: And I applaud him right off. I start right there. I said, my gosh, I said, as that, in that role, I said, you see the whole game. You know, you're, you're, you're talking to the picture. The picture is supposed to be sending you whatever, whatever You're saying, Hey, this is the next, this is the vision we need. And you become basically the captain of the team to do that.

[00:06:12] Mark Corbett: So was that interesting, both as a young woman being the unofficial captain, if you will, as a catcher, or is that realistic of me to say that 

[00:06:23] Lois Youngen: Well, maybe I thought, but I'm not sure.

[00:06:29] Sue Zipay Parsons: I told you, she just have a good story for you, Mark. 

[00:06:33] Mark Corbett: Oh, no, no doubt. Oh man. No, but again, I said the catchers though, you know, in life you see a lot of them become managers as well, but let's talk about the manager position with. With the young ladies at that time, uh, there had to be protocols or had to be things they could and couldn't do.

[00:06:51] Mark Corbett: I know they showed the Hanks character falling down drunk or coming into the, the, uh, locker room, et cetera. 

[00:06:58] Lois Youngen: No one would ever have done that in the 1940s, not even Tom Hanks in person. It just wouldn't have happened. 

[00:07:08] Mark Corbett: That's part of the Hollywood hyperbole, I guess. 

[00:07:10] Lois Youngen: That's part of the Hollywood hyperbole.

[00:07:12] Lois Youngen: Yep. 

[00:07:14] Mark Corbett: Oh my gosh. So how did you still connect with, with the league itself? How did the introduction go? 

[00:07:24] Lois Youngen: Well, for me, it's different for each gal. I think there were many tryouts in the beginning. See, I played at the end of the league. The league started in 43. Started with four teams. It grew to eight teams in 1947 and 48, and then it dropped out again.

[00:07:42] Lois Youngen: I played the last four years, 1951 through 54, and we had six teams in 51. And then in the next three years, we only had. Five. And I guess I should call myself Lois the Terminator. No! No! 

[00:07:59] Mark Corbett: Of course. Well, 

[00:08:01] Lois Youngen: that's the end. That was the end of the league then in 1954. But we had 12 very good years. And in 1947 and 48, almost a million people saw those eight teams play.

[00:08:15] Lois Youngen: Now, keep in mind, we played every night, seven days a week with double hitters on Sunday. Um, my phone's ringing. I'm sorry. I'm going to whip over here and shut it off. 

[00:08:26] Mark Corbett: That's 

[00:08:27] Lois Youngen: what I 

[00:08:32] Mark Corbett: like about not being alive. Yes,

[00:08:44] Sue Zipay Parsons: Lois has a PhD. Yeah, I think that's what you call it from here. 

[00:08:49] Mark Corbett: Sorry about that. 

[00:08:50] Sue Zipay Parsons: I would just tell them about your doctorate or whatever you have, you know, bells and whistles education. 

[00:08:57] Mark Corbett: Yeah, let me go back. We'll kind of introduce that then come to it. Well, 

[00:09:00] Lois Youngen: anyway, I had us having a million people see the eight teams play and that's because we played over 100 games.

[00:09:09] Lois Youngen: It varied from 100 to 110 or so.

[00:09:15] Lois Youngen: One more 

[00:09:15] Sue Zipay Parsons: time. I just wanted to jump in here. It's a far cry from what MLB now does with their pitch. You know, they have X number of pitches and they have to take them out. You know, some of our girls pitched a game and then they pitched the next day. They pitched a game again, a full game. And of course we were doing nine innings at that time.

[00:09:35] Sue Zipay Parsons: Now, now the girls are doing the seven inning games. 

[00:09:39] Mark Corbett: Well, I'm curious to, I mean, what you were a pitcher yourself, aren't you? Yeah. 

[00:09:42] Sue Zipay Parsons: Not much. I, he only put me in there when he was desperate and I, I basically played second base and I played right field and I didn't play a whole lot first year. I was only two years, uh, 52 and 

[00:09:55] Mark Corbett: 53.

[00:09:55] Mark Corbett: Wow. 

[00:09:55] Sue Zipay Parsons: And the second year I was beginning to feel like one of the gang, really, although even as a rookie going into the league. Um, the players that had been there for many years were so receptive and, and so kind to the young girls coming in, it was like a family really was. 

[00:10:12] Mark Corbett: Well, that's important. I mean, we talk a lot, you know, when I'm like, even today with the youngsters at the boys and girls club talking about team, we're talking about community, we're talking about spirit, you know, and having that energy that you share together.

[00:10:25] Mark Corbett: And to me, that's, that's a big part of when I, when I see that you all have been doing not just from historically, but also what's happening now. And we'll talk about that in a moment about in Sarasota and you're also meetings. Um, I did want to ask in regards to fans, what were the fans like to you all in the stands?

[00:10:46] Mark Corbett: How are y'all treated by your fans? 

[00:10:48] Lois Youngen: Wonderfully. We had a fan base that would rival any of the major leaguers, only on a smaller scale. And we had a Daisy Fan Club. I don't remember one in South Bend, but we had a Daisy Fan Club. And I'm not quite sure all the things that they did for us, but they did have a picnic for us once a year.

[00:11:11] Lois Youngen: And, um, I can't tell you what else to be honest with you. I can remember the older gentleman that was the president. He offseason and any news about baseball related to our team. Uh, he'd send it on to us between what would be, uh, October and the following May, let's say. So, I, I'm not sure what other functions he had, but, um, I, uh, he was, I, I can see him now.

[00:11:47] Lois Youngen: He was very, very nice gentleman. 

[00:11:50] Mark Corbett: Well, 

[00:11:50] Lois Youngen: let, 

[00:11:50] Mark Corbett: let me ask you, you all both. Did I understand is it was it a hundred games a year? Is that what you're saying? 

[00:11:57] Lois Youngen: Yes, every night seven days a week with double headers on sundays Occasionally we have a day off not very often. I know at the end of july I was wishing that I knew more about oregon rain and a little of it would fly over and drop a little rain on us We had a day off or two but uh seven days a week double headers on sunday 

[00:12:23] Mark Corbett: Wow.

[00:12:23] Mark Corbett: The 

[00:12:23] Lois Youngen: double hitters were only seven innings each, otherwise it was a full nine innings. 

[00:12:28] Mark Corbett: Yeah. 

[00:12:29] Sue Zipay Parsons: And then Mark, in addition, the ride home on the bus all night and then getting up the next morning for practice for the next day. 

[00:12:38] Mark Corbett: You know, I could see that whether either lay you out or you'd have to become a great athlete.

[00:12:43] Mark Corbett: I don't think there'd be much room for anything in between. 

[00:12:45] Sue Zipay Parsons: We were young and we were healthy and we loved the game, right, Lois? Absolutely! Just loved it. 

[00:12:51] Mark Corbett: A 

[00:12:53] Lois Youngen: number of players would tell you that they would have paid their organization to play rather than getting paid. I didn't say that, but people have, uh, yeah, Ketcher had a pretty tough time behind the plate.

[00:13:08] Lois Youngen: Uh, there are some things you need to know about us. 

[00:13:12] Mark Corbett: Please. 

[00:13:13] Lois Youngen: We played in that revolutionary one piece dress that you saw in the movie. 

[00:13:17] Mark Corbett: Mmm. 

[00:13:19] Lois Youngen: All right? And, uh, unfortunately, Mrs. Wrigley designed it. And she was enamored by Sonia Henney, who's a wonderful skater. She made it with the skirt so full that every time you bent over to field the ground ball, all you got was skirt.

[00:13:37] Lois Youngen: Oh, this was with the original girls in 43. And they said they immediately had to get big safety pins and pin in all that material. And then by the time Sue and I got to the league, Over the years, we had shortened that dress and shortened it and shortened it and shortened it. So when I played and Sue played, we played in a miniskirt.

[00:14:03] Lois Youngen: So, in other words, We had tights underneath, but we had full movement of both legs, but was still one piece dress. And I often wondered why Mrs. Wrigley wasn't smart enough to make it at least two pieces. So when you raised your arm, your whole uniform didn't come up, but obviously she was not a baseball player.

[00:14:28] Mark Corbett: Yeah. You, you always wonder when somebody creates something and they don't have to use it, you know how they do. And 

[00:14:35] Lois Youngen: I mean, all 12 years. Good Lord woman. It was a revolutionary uniform and it lasted. It was a thread that went through all 12 years of the league. Wow. Wow. Wow. 

[00:14:50] Mark Corbett: I keep wondering though, I see some of those cases where you see somebody slatting in the basement.

[00:14:55] Mark Corbett: No, no, no. I mean, the strawberries that you guys must've got the, the cuts, scrapes, and bruises must've been unbelievable. 

[00:15:03] Lois Youngen: Well, Sue will tell you, if we got a strawberry early in June, you had it at Thanksgiving, because you had to keep sliding on, we always slid feet first. I don't know if you remember in the movie, Madonna slides head first on her material girl's bosom.

[00:15:20] Mark Corbett: I 

[00:15:21] Lois Youngen: wonder if they paid her extra, Sue, what do you think? I don't know. Uh, but we never slid head first, other than the fact that if you got caught off the first base, you slid back head first. But, um, We did what the men were doing in the major leagues and they weren't P Rose hadn't been born yet. I don't think, but anyway, uh, we were sliding feet first and not head first into second, third home.

[00:15:49] Mark Corbett: Wow. Let me ask you another question too. You played for a couple of different teams. Were you assigned to those teams? Did you choose those teams? How did that work out? 

[00:16:01] Lois Youngen: Well, I got, I tried out for the Fort Wayne daisies. And, uh, they, uh, one summer between my junior and senior year in high school, I was 16 in January of that year, they sent me a letter saying that, um, if I'm still interested, they'd like me to come to spring training along with 30 other, I'd be trying out with 30 other girls.

[00:16:29] Lois Youngen: About, uh, maybe two or three weeks later, I got a check for 20 to get me to spring training. So I went to spring training. I, uh, the hardest part was getting out of high school because in those days you didn't get out unless somebody died. So I got out of spring, I got out of school, went to spring training.

[00:16:55] Lois Youngen: I think it was about four weeks long. I'm not quite sure on the length. Anyway, I came back, this was my senior year in high school. I went to my senior prom. I went through graduation and I became a Fort Wayne Daisy all in one week. Oh, wow. There you are. . 

[00:17:16] Mark Corbett: Well, that's a heck of a story. I mean, my gosh. I mean, it's such a change.

[00:17:21] Mark Corbett: I was wondering how the scouts did, I mean, we went out to find great talent, but there wasn't, well they 

[00:17:26] Lois Youngen: did at the beginning. Yeah, I guess in the beginning. By the time I got there, I actually. I don't think they were doing any scouting, but they certainly allowed players to come in and try out. And I just happened to be in the right place at the right time, visiting a relative in Fort Wayne.

[00:17:44] Lois Youngen: They said, do you want to go see the daisies play? And I said, well, well, what do you think? You know, yes, yes. And in the seventh inning stretch, I turned to my cousin and I said, I can do this is 16 year old. Now I can do that. And the next morning I had this tryout, which led to the letter, which led to the check for 20.

[00:18:09] Lois Youngen: So, but I tried up and I think many of the gals tried out, but in the beginning they had scouts floating around. Wow. 

[00:18:17] Mark Corbett: Well, that's exciting. I mean, to think. If you're passionate about something, I think people, you know, they will go for it and yourself in that particular instance, it was obvious that you were taken by what they were doing on the field, wanting to be a part of it, but it, it takes like the physicality and the athleticism to do that.

[00:18:35] Mark Corbett: I respect that, but I just cannot imagine with you all doing seven days a week, good Lord, and a hundred games a year with, with, and with double headers, you said on Sunday. 

[00:18:46] Sue Zipay Parsons: Doubleheaders. Every Sunday. And you're talking about the fans there. I was going to say that so many of them were the farmer boys because there were so many farms around there and they would come out.

[00:18:56] Sue Zipay Parsons: That was their recreation on the weekends in particular. Those were the ones we dated. And then a few of them. And then, um, yeah, they'd have cookouts for us. You know, I can remember the steaks in the cookout. Sweet corn and everything all fixed for us when we come home from our road trip. That was, that was our treat, you know, we'd have a big cookout.

[00:19:18] Sue Zipay Parsons: Yeah, the fans were very good to us. 

[00:19:21] Lois Youngen: Wow. 

[00:19:22] Mark Corbett: I mean, but it goes like 

[00:19:24] Lois Youngen: there was much else to do in those days. There's no television, right? Major League Baseball is so far away. Gas was rationed. Still, you know, you couldn't drive to a major league game. Um, so they stayed local and they treated us very well.

[00:19:41] Lois Youngen: Just like Sue said. 

[00:19:45] Mark Corbett: I mean, there was something I heard as far as like spring training. Did, did you all have spring training? 

[00:19:52] Sue Zipay Parsons: We did. It wasn't, I don't remember how long it was. I'm not as good at just remembering stuff as lowest, but I remember when I arrived there, I thought I was a pretty hotshot player back home, but when I got there and saw the level of, uh, the ability, I said, Oh, wow, I'm just a small, a little fish in a big pond here.

[00:20:16] Sue Zipay Parsons: And realized that, you know, I was going to have to work to stay there. The, the, the, uh, coach said to me when I was very nervous about being there, said, you wouldn't be here if you weren't as good as the rest of us, Sue. So just stop worrying about it. 

[00:20:29] Mark Corbett: Good deal. Wow. So, you know, To me, the whole idea of being on the road and the bus and all of these other women that you get to the camaraderie, you're able to build and Lois, like both of y'all were saying, as far as coming home to fans after being on the road and having a big cookout, my gosh, that, that had to be exciting, but.

[00:20:54] Mark Corbett: It's still probably a lot of folks, especially since y'all were young, missing family at home. Oh God. 

[00:21:00] Lois Youngen: Oh, now, wait a minute. Sue and I had a chaperone. 

[00:21:05] Mark Corbett: Every 

[00:21:07] Lois Youngen: team had a chaperone and that's another thread that went through all 12 years. Every team had 

[00:21:15] Sue Zipay Parsons: a woman. But homesick was something that I was initially.

[00:21:18] Sue Zipay Parsons: I wrote home every night. I've never been away from home, from my home in Massachusetts. It's. And it was tough. And by the way, the chaperone was the one who, who I tried out with in my, in my state of Massachusetts, she was about 30 miles away. And I went drove to her house because my, uh, my high school softball coach said, did you know there was a pro league in the West?

[00:21:40] Sue Zipay Parsons: And I said, what? And I was visualizing millions of dollars and fame and fortune. And I went up and had a tryout with this Dottie Green, her name was. He originally had played in the league and, and tore her knee apart practically and decided to stay on as a chaperone. So she was with the Rockford peaches for many, many years.

[00:21:59] Sue Zipay Parsons: And, um, and so she, uh, apparently like what she saw when I went up to throw a few balls and two weeks later, I got a contract in the mail and it just, that was it. Wow. 

[00:22:12] Mark Corbett: As I was wondering, one of the questions I was about the chaperones, you wouldn't say a little more about that, Lois. I want to hear that as well.

[00:22:20] Lois Youngen: Oh, I was just going to say it's a thread that went through all 12 years. And I think probably many of the gals would not have been able to play due to their parents objection, possibly, because we had a chaperone, it became a possibility and then a reality for many players. 

[00:22:42] Mark Corbett: Wow. 

[00:22:44] Sue Zipay Parsons: And the chaperone was the one that took care of the strawberries.

[00:22:47] Sue Zipay Parsons: The chaperone was the one that found the host for you to stay in. We stayed in private homes. And by the way, when we came home, they did our laundry. And there was, it was always a nice homemade cheesecake waiting for us when we arrived home. Not in Fort Wayne. Obviously I was with the wrong team. I, that's right, you were, I always, I've been telling you that for how many years now.

[00:23:09] Sue Zipay Parsons: Lois and I have a little thing going between the Blue Sox and the, uh, and the Rocks and Peaches. 

[00:23:16] Mark Corbett: That cheesecake sounds good. Oh, uh, Lois, I got a question to ask you being here from Tampa and near Ybor, you know, one thing we celebrate down at the Tampa Baseball Museum is Shoe Shoe Worth. 

[00:23:28] Lois Youngen: This is Sue. Yeah.

[00:23:29] Lois Youngen: Sue's Tampa. 

[00:23:32] Mark Corbett: No, I know. I'm talking about the lady that came from here, Lois. I'm talking about Choo Choo 

[00:23:37] Lois Youngen: from Ybor, 

[00:23:39] Mark Corbett: and she was with the South Bend Blue Sox. Was that she there when you were there? 

[00:23:44] Lois Youngen: No, she was before I arrived, but I did know her name and I did hear her name. I didn't know she was from Florida at the time.

[00:23:54] Lois Youngen: Um, I can't tell you too much about her. I thought at one time that she, she was married. I'm not sure, maybe not, to a serviceman. Um, and, um, I know she was a very little girl, you know, petite, dark hair. I've seen pictures of her in, in a team on a, you know, team pictures of the South Bend team. I think she played shortstop or second base.

[00:24:26] Lois Youngen: He was an infielder. 

[00:24:28] Mark Corbett: Yeah. I've never seen shortstop. Yeah. No, that's fine. I was just curious because I knew she'd been with the South Bend Blue Sox. I couldn't remember which year she was with them, but it goes to thinking also the, the breadth and width of where everybody came from. I mean, Sue, you're from Massachusetts and you've got somebody all the way down here from Florida as well.

[00:24:47] Mark Corbett: Uh, and yourself, Lois, you're from Ohio. So 

[00:24:51] Lois Youngen: we had Canadians, a lot of Canadians, and we had some Cubans. Now, 

[00:24:59] Mark Corbett: tell me if I'm wrong, I understand on the, like if Cuba, not only did you have teams that were interracial, but you had men and women playing together on those teams as well. So it wasn't just, you know, one way or another, it wasn't women just playing baseball by themselves in Cuba.

[00:25:16] Mark Corbett: They were also playing with the men. 

[00:25:18] Lois Youngen: I don't know. I don't know nothing about that, but if you look at the history of the All American Girls Professional Baseball League and say that fast 20 times, Ridley is stupid. Anyway, uh, in 1948 for spring training, Either 47 or 48, the league, every player, every team was, took the train to Florida and then they were flown over to Cuba.

[00:25:48] Mark Corbett: Oh my gosh. 

[00:25:49] Lois Youngen: That's spring train. All of them. And they had spring training there. 

[00:25:53] Mark Corbett: Wow. 

[00:25:54] Lois Youngen: At the same time, at least it's, it's probably grown into a myth. But anyway, the Dodgers were there at the same time. Well, the Cubans evidently had never seen blonde women baseball players, because I guess the 20, 000 people that normally would have seen the Dodgers play all decided the women were much more interesting.

[00:26:17] Lois Youngen: The Dodgers got left in the dust. Dem bums got to, had to fend for themselves. Ha ha ha. And, um, uh, talked to a couple of the gals. They're not with us anymore, but they said, If you weren't careful, you got pinched four or five times every day. So the Cubans were pretty, I guess, uh, aggressive to say the least.

[00:26:41] Lois Youngen: And I know the gal that pitched the perfect game, Jean Fout, does not like fish. And she was there and she said she lost, I don't know how many pounds because all they had to eat was fish or that was the majority of the meat that they had. So, but they were very popular and that's the connection then. to get some of the women, the young women from Cuba back to play in our league.

[00:27:07] Lois Youngen: And there were four or five or six of them over the, from 48 to 54. I played with one, Isabel Alvarez, who was a left handed pitcher. 

[00:27:18] Sue Zipay Parsons: It's all pictures. I think I played with Mickey Perez, whose dad had a tire that he hung up in a tree in the backyard, and he used to make her throw through the, through the tire just right.

[00:27:29] Sue Zipay Parsons: Well, she never could throw hard but she she could have control like you wouldn't believe. Little bit of thing. And somebody told me that she got killed in the Bay of Pigs but then I found out later that wasn't true, because Lois I don't know if you know this it's only like Three or four years ago, she was over in Miami and she died over there.

[00:27:46] Sue Zipay Parsons: And I never knew that. 

[00:27:49] Lois Youngen: I, all I know that another picture we had, um, lived in Florida, got married and, and lived in the Miami area. Um, but we only had her address and a phone number and so on. So she never came to a reunion. We never got to, you know, reacquainted, so to speak with her. Okay. Well, one 

[00:28:10] Sue Zipay Parsons: question I want to ask you, you mentioned a bat girl.

[00:28:14] Sue Zipay Parsons: That was living in Florida, and I found out she lived up at the Villages. I was telling Marcus, but I cannot remember what her name was. She was the daughter of one of the coaches or something. 

[00:28:26] Lois Youngen: Oh, uh, Jimmy Foxx's daughter was back for the Fort Wayne team that summer that she, that he, he was our manager.

[00:28:36] Lois Youngen: And I 

[00:28:36] Sue Zipay Parsons: understand 

[00:28:36] Lois Youngen: she 

[00:28:37] Sue Zipay Parsons: lives up at the Villages, Mark. 

[00:28:39] Mark Corbett: Oh, wow. You got to reach out to those folks. I know, I know there's some other retired major league baseball players, but I think that's where a lot of them go, but, uh, wow. I want to remind everybody, listen, the baseball is on deck and we're talking with Lois Youngin and Sousa Zipaye from the all American girls professional baseball league, get a little bit of the history of what's going on with the game and insight that I never had before.

[00:29:02] Mark Corbett: So I want to thank you ladies. Well, I certainly have a few more questions for you, but I'm going to let, I'm going Remind people, you know, all that you brought to sports and that's something to one more thing. I want to make sure with Lois, we talk about is being part of that battery, being that catcher and pitcher.

[00:29:18] Mark Corbett: And Gene Fout was the person that one of the pitchers you had, what was the communication with you guys? Like, how was it either calling the signs? Did you have a, just a good synergy or was it something you had to really work at? 

[00:29:33] Lois Youngen: Well, uh, uh, Jean was, as far as I'm concerned, the GOAT of the overhand pitchers in our league, and from the mid 1940s on.

[00:29:48] Lois Youngen: Um, she pitched her perfect game in the end of the 1943 season at Kalamazoo. And it was, I think, September 3rd, and we won that game four to zero. I had been traded to South Bend in 1953. Yes, I said traded. So what happened? And so I had had the opportunity to catch her more than once.

[00:30:19] Lois Youngen: Uh, and so when we got to the end of the season and we got to Kalamazoo, I had a pretty good idea of what, what she could throw and where she could throw it and, uh, at what speeds. So you know, in those days, things are pretty simple. One was a fastball, two was a curve, three was a change and a fist was a pitch out.

[00:30:39] Lois Youngen: How about that? So, uh, she could put her, first of all, I would like to have known. How fast she really was because we had no way of knowing. There were no guns, you know, speed guns or whatever. Um, I did ask her once when she was retired and we were at a reunion, how fast she thought she, you know, how fast are, did you, do you think you were in your heyday?

[00:31:08] Lois Youngen: And she said she didn't know, but she thought between 85 and 90, but she wasn't sure if she could hit 90. Now remember, until 1954, our pitching distance was 57, between 56 and 57. It wasn't 60. We were three, three feet short. Um, And we were using a 10 inch baseball, not a nine inch, but it was being thrown overhand, which means you could make it do what you wanted to do if you were good at doing that kind of thing.

[00:31:42] Lois Youngen: So, um, I'd say she had the, she was the fastest in our league. And secondly, she could put the ball anywhere, her fastball, anywhere she wanted it, so she had really good control most of the time and she could throw a curve ball. Depending on the night, you know, we're not always great every time out. It would, uh, how did somebody explain it?

[00:32:09] Lois Youngen: Dropped off like a country road. So, uh, and obviously we use the change up probably not as much as we should have, but her fastball was so good. Uh, she could put it where she wanted, as I said, and then every third or fourth pitch, we could throw in a curve ball, depending on how good it was that particular evening.

[00:32:30] Lois Youngen: Obviously it was good when we pitched, when she pitched her perfect game. So she had eight put outs that day. Eight strikeouts. 

[00:32:41] Mark Corbett: Gotcha. Gotcha. Hey, Sue, I want to ask you to, uh, When you were playing, what, what is, when you were playing, who was the best pitcher on, excuse me, let me rephrase it, batting action, who's the best batter you saw in the league?

[00:32:56] Sue Zipay Parsons: Oh, gosh, I used to think it was the weavers, right? Right. Joe Weaver, probably they could hit it over the country fence. They were so big and strong. They were, yeah. 

[00:33:09] Mark Corbett: So was it two sisters? 

[00:33:12] Lois Youngen: Yes, Jean and Joe, Joanne, called Joe Weaver and Jean, and then her other sister was Betty Foss. There were three of them.

[00:33:24] Lois Youngen: And they were, they were all, well, the two of the sisters were over six feet. So they had nice long levers. Which means that what's happening at the end when you make contact is a little faster than some of we short folks like Sue and I, I'm five three . I was, I think I'm 5 5 1 now, I think. But I, I was all of five three, maybe a little more than that, I don't know.

[00:33:57] Lois Youngen: But Sue's about my size and we're, we're pretty much weighed the same, I'd think, what, 115 maybe when we were playing. That's about, well, I was about 120. Yeah. Yeah. I'll take 120. That's okay. I had a lot of muscle then.

[00:34:16] Mark Corbett: Well, you know, you're, you're enjoying this, Lee, you have all these great people around, you got the community, but then one day the word comes down. There's not going to be a league anymore. How, how has that delivered and how, how did people deal with it? 

[00:34:29] Sue Zipay Parsons: Oh, God. You really want to know. 

[00:34:31] Lois Youngen: I don't, I don't remember how it was.

[00:34:35] Lois Youngen: Well, we heard rumors all year in 1954. We, I had anyway, I was back with Fort Wayne then, um, Fort Wayne needed to, uh, I don't know how I got back to Fort Wayne, to be honest with you, but in 54, I started with Fort Wayne and my manager said, I'm going to make an outfielder out of you because you're this, this and this, and we have a catcher.

[00:35:03] Lois Youngen: So I played left field a lot, uh, 1954. I don't know how I got back to Fort Wayne, uh, but I did. And there were rumors that, uh, People, you know, whisper campaign, I guess. I don't know that, uh, there wouldn't be possibly a league the following year, but I don't know how, I don't think they ever told us face to face.

[00:35:26] Lois Youngen: I think it's something that just sort of happened and it hit the newspapers, probably. I got 

[00:35:33] Sue Zipay Parsons: notified at home. After we went home and I had no inkling that it was going to happen because being a rookie, I didn't hear some of the local gossip in Rockford as to what was happening. But, uh, it was really sad because, as I said, two years, My first year was a learning experience getting my feet wet, um, and my second year I started to feel good and you know, I could hit the ball a country mile, but when I get up to bed, I was so damn nervous.

[00:36:00] Sue Zipay Parsons: It was because women never had that experience. 

[00:36:03] Mark Corbett: Yeah, 

[00:36:04] Sue Zipay Parsons: we never had fans like the boys will have the football fans there and then they get used to it. And, uh, I, I just, uh, it took me a while, but anyhow, it was very sad. I think every one of us have said the same thing. It was one of the saddest days of our lives because at that age and playing the baseball, the game we loved, and then to have them say it's no more.

[00:36:25] Sue Zipay Parsons: And it was like, what do I do? So, of course, most of us got, most of us just got married and I married the groundskeeper, the groundskeeper from Rockford by a stadium. We had been dating for a year and he didn't want to lose me. And yeah, you know, he went to Pensacola for pre flight and then went in the service.

[00:36:43] Sue Zipay Parsons: And as soon as he got his wings, we got married and started a family. So that was it. 

[00:36:48] Mark Corbett: That's sweet. But it's, I've, I've heard so many stories though, above and beyond being the athletes that you were that, you know, many of you have gone out here, whether somebody would be professional tennis player or a bowler.

[00:37:02] Lois Youngen: Yes, that happened. A lot of people, a lot of the gals went on. A lot of them went 

[00:37:08] Mark Corbett: on 

[00:37:09] Lois Youngen: to play other sports, maybe not professionally, but they certainly got involved. Gene Fout, for example, was a bowler, became a very, very outstanding bowler. Well, 

[00:37:24] Sue Zipay Parsons: you do know that my second sport was tennis, Mark. I don't know if you know this, and I was playing 40 and over at that age that I was playing.

[00:37:33] Sue Zipay Parsons: I was 50, but I was playing 40 and over. And I got ranked up in New England in doubles and then moved to Florida and bought a small tennis club down here, which I still own. I can see it looking out my window. I live right next door to it. My son runs it now. But I got up to a pretty high level with tennis and, uh, was playing tournaments down here until they made the movie, A League of Their Own movie, in which I was told to hit a line drive over second and run to second by Penny Marshall.

[00:38:01] Sue Zipay Parsons: And I did that for one whole day over and over. And I hadn't played baseball for 40 years. I'd been playing tennis and that happened to wreck my left knee. When I came back, I had an operation and then that was the end of my tennis career. link their own on that one. 

[00:38:18] Mark Corbett: Yeah! Wow! My gosh! But you know the thing of it was looking at, at all this came to conclusion that there's really wasn't an evolution of Of seeing public teams playing women's baseball, you know, the next thing I saw as far as women's baseball was long before that movie came out to leave their own was bad news bears.

[00:38:41] Mark Corbett: And, oh, this is just, you know, man, you mental. This is a, this has never happened before. Is it Jodie Foster or somebody, you know, and she's on there with Baltimore. We've got a girl on the team, but as you're talking, I mean, The women have been playing baseball everywhere else. Canada, they've been playing it for a long time.

[00:38:58] Mark Corbett: Cuba, they said they were playing it. Japan is 

[00:39:00] Sue Zipay Parsons: number one right now. 

[00:39:02] Mark Corbett: There you go. And it's, so now, I know I'm looking right now, Sue, you're, you're making, taking special efforts and to make sure that is reinvigorated here in the United States. Could you tell us a little bit about that? 

[00:39:17] Sue Zipay Parsons: Uh, that's funny. Uh, we had a meeting the other day and I, I got in touch with the gal who's been in baseball for a long time.

[00:39:23] Sue Zipay Parsons: She had a brain concussion and she spent many years trying to overcome it. Don't know if you know, Tina Nichols, her name is. Okay. And she, it was interesting. She brought a little flag, homemade flag that she made, and it had listed Oh, I would say maybe 10 of the top women's baseball teams in the world.

[00:39:41] Sue Zipay Parsons: And, uh, and here at the top is, uh, Japan. And then I can't remember the other two and USA is number four. And I said, you know, we should, we should make this into a banner from a tournament. In, uh, November and just put a little arrow. They're saying, okay, this is where we want to be up at the top. Number one, where Japan is.

[00:40:00] Sue Zipay Parsons: Well, Japan, you know, they're funded by the government. They play all year round. They have a professional league. So the women are playing and practicing. Our women play when they can on a weekend, they get together once in a while. They're going to come down here and play in this tournament. And most of them hardly ever play with each other.

[00:40:18] Sue Zipay Parsons: They know each other. But I mean, it's, you can call it a rag tag group of women ball players, but they're all so good. You know, they just mesh right in there. And so it works. So that's my thing is I think I've mentioned before that I, one of the things that got me going, one of our former players who's since passed away at a players meeting had said to me.

[00:40:40] Sue Zipay Parsons: About our board of directors that they don't do anything. So, and I was on the board way back when it was first put together in the 80s. I forget when you, I don't remember dates like Louis does, but and I thought to myself all these years I've been into tennis and then I jumped back into the scene. The All Americans, because I couldn't play tennis anymore.

[00:41:01] Sue Zipay Parsons: And I said, she's right. You know, I don't know what happened, but from all these years, from 1954 to 2023, there's no baseball. That's absurd. We were the first team of professional women in the country. Okay. Then the movie came out and we sparked all the women to become athletes. And they have, and they all have pro leagues and we have nothing.

[00:41:22] Sue Zipay Parsons: So why is that? Because nobody ever took the time to get out and do what needed to be done, which I'm doing, you know, to show the public, these women can play to present a program and on and on it goes. I could spend a lot of time here going into this, but 

[00:41:39] Mark Corbett: well, the good news is it's, you know, you're Putting the spark plug back into this.

[00:41:43] Mark Corbett: I mean, the whole thing that you've got going with this tournament coming up in Sarasota. And I wonder by the listeners, mark this down. I'll put it at the end of the notes too. It's coming up in November. Let's see the 17th, 18th and 

[00:41:56] Sue Zipay Parsons: 19th. Yes. 

[00:41:58] Mark Corbett: And that's it. Go ahead. 

[00:41:59] Sue Zipay Parsons: By the way, there was a, a big, nice article in the Sarasota Herald Tribune today by Doug Fernandez.

[00:42:06] Sue Zipay Parsons: It was nice. He sent me the link and I kind of sent it out to everybody I could think of. And, and that's the thing we get, we need to get the word out because last year we had an excellent tournament. Everybody said it was just great, but there were no people in the stands. So this year, the whole thing is how do we get people in the stands?

[00:42:23] Sue Zipay Parsons: Well, luckily, some guy called me up and his name was Mark Corbett. And I said, Oh, God, thank you, God. You sent me somebody that can help us. 

[00:42:33] Mark Corbett: Well, I'll tell you what, it's a pleasure and to work with you guys and to try to make something like this happen and make it bigger and better because to me, to, to give any person, and I've, I've told you before, Sue, with our, you know, Karen, our, our two young girls, not, well, not so young anymore, they're younger than me, but, uh, to, to have them have chances to do different things.

[00:42:56] Mark Corbett: And. Baseball baseball has been denied. I mean, you know, all the, I know several young women who've come up playing softball and never really even had the opportunity to think about baseball. So I think this is a great opportunity with the tournament and I don't have the full list in front of me of all the players that you have coming, but we're talking about some superior players.

[00:43:16] Mark Corbett: This, you, you use the word rag tag, but I'm thinking, uh, 

[00:43:20] Lois Youngen: USA team members, USA world. Cup team 

[00:43:24] Sue Zipay Parsons: members from the USA national 

[00:43:26] Mark Corbett: team. 

[00:43:27] Sue Zipay Parsons: And we have, we have more than half of the national team coming to play. And, uh, and plus the ones we had last year, which were probably just as good, but, you know, maybe they have full time jobs instead.

[00:43:40] Mark Corbett: So people need to stand up, take notice and because attend this tournament, because you're not going to get to see these people all the time. And, you know, I think the great hope is Sue, and you correct me if I'm wrong, is to build enough interest and excitement that there will be a league of league of professional women baseball players.

[00:43:59] Sue Zipay Parsons: That's exactly what I'm trying to do is I want the public to see how well these women play. And then somebody is going to come along that has a deep pockets and some money and says, this can be a viable business and it can be profitable because my whole vision is not just to have this tournament, my whole vision is to have a pro league right here in these stadiums.

[00:44:20] Sue Zipay Parsons: We've got the, the, okay, the Orioles up here in Sarasota and the Pirates, and then they got the Braves over here in Northcourt, half hour away. Then we got the Tampa Bay Rays in Port Charlotte and the Red Sox down here in Fort Myers. We can have four teams. That's what our league started with four professional teams like the ones I've I've got listed with their new uniforms that say Rockford in South Bend and the comments in the bells, and, and we can do it right here in the wintertime September, October, November, December, March.

[00:44:52] Sue Zipay Parsons: Okay. What's going on in those stadiums. They're looking for revenue during that time. 

[00:44:55] Mark Corbett: Yeah. 

[00:44:56] Sue Zipay Parsons: But the snowbirds down here, we've got grandpas that want to have their grandkids come down for Christmas and take them to a women's pro league game. And it won't cost that much. We can keep the price down, make it reasonable instead of spending 500 to take your family to a major league baseball game.

[00:45:10] Sue Zipay Parsons: I mean, it all makes sense. Everybody I've talked to has said, that's a great idea. Why don't we have women's baseball? That's the comment that comes back to me. So 

[00:45:21] Lois Youngen: it's there and there are, may I interject, and there are women out there that do play baseball. Yes, it's not as if we don't have some players floating around this country and the 

[00:45:33] Sue Zipay Parsons: young ones 

[00:45:34] Lois Youngen: that are 

[00:45:34] Sue Zipay Parsons: coming up, or even.

[00:45:36] Sue Zipay Parsons: They're so good, the young ones, you know, they've been playing with the little league. And that's the other thing, the little girls that are playing and sitting on the bench with all the boys, they don't like that. When I ran a camp for girls over here at the Braves Stadium, and when the girls came in and they looked out on the field and they said, Oh my God, it's all girls.

[00:45:53] Sue Zipay Parsons: They were amazed. They were thrilled. They made friends. All of a sudden there was camaraderie. 

[00:45:58] Mark Corbett: Wow. 

[00:45:58] Sue Zipay Parsons: They don't have that in the dugout with the boys. And that's wrong. That's wrong. And the whole thing is not right. 

[00:46:05] Mark Corbett: Well, I think a lot of people maybe will get the right idea if they're smart enough, come down here and watch some of the games, get 

[00:46:10] Sue Zipay Parsons: them in their seat.

[00:46:11] Sue Zipay Parsons: That's right. 

[00:46:14] Mark Corbett: Wow. Well, ladies, I can't thank y'all enough for being here today on baseball biz on deck. We've been talking with Sousa Zipay and Lois Youngin. Uh, both you ladies are fantastic. I appreciate you sharing the history of the game that you've enjoyed and looking forward to do some rejuvenation of what's happening with baseball and women.

[00:46:32] Mark Corbett: for the future as well. So thank you very much and look forward to talking both, both of y'all again real soon. 

[00:46:39] Sue Zipay Parsons: Thank you, Mark. Thank you very much for having us.