Janet Marie Smith, Dodgers, Senior Vice President of Planning and Development - WIB

Janet Marie Smith, Baseball, Architect, Designer, Senior VP at Lost Angeles Dodgers – Women in Baseball on BaseballBiz

[00:00:00] Mark Corbett: Welcome to BaseballBiz On Deck. And we have yet another edition with a focus of women in baseball. And as you know, that spans so many different things. If we're looking at coaches, if we're looking at players, looking at college and looking at executives in the game, whether it be the front office or the people who are making a difference in developing things, and today I am very happy to announce we have Janet Marie Smith with us.

[00:00:27] Mark Corbett: How are you doing today? Janet Marie. I should get that right. Oh, anyway, 

[00:00:33] Janet Marie Smith: both is fine. I do both. Don't worry. 

[00:00:38] Mark Corbett: It's to me, it's there's something Southern about that too. And in genteel about having both names together. Uh, 

[00:00:45] Janet Marie Smith: well, it's, that's the Mississippi in me, I guess. 

[00:00:49] Mark Corbett: I love it. Well, you know, before we get too much into this, you've got a background in with Mississippi.

[00:00:55] Mark Corbett: I think it was you, uh, the university there, you studied architecture. Yeah. And Then later on, you were doing urban planning. I think it was like in New York. Is that correct? Wow. And now, my gosh, what you've been able to build on top of that to me is just huge. I'm looking at everything. It's funny. Uh, whether it be Camden Yards, Fenway, Dodger Stadium, Ed Smith Stadium.

[00:01:19] Mark Corbett: And the funny thing was, Janet Marie, before I was thinking much about you, last year, I went to three of those places. 

[00:01:25] Janet Marie Smith: That's great. A road trip. 

[00:01:27] Mark Corbett: Exactly. Uh, the wife and I visited, uh, Fenway, Camden Yards, and myself, I went down to Ed Smith to watch the All Americans, some of the women were putting together a tournament down there, so that was kind of fun.

[00:01:38] Mark Corbett: There's so many things to talk about, and yes, you are a leader as far as women in baseball and with executives and achieving things, and I know being the vice president of planning and development for a couple of teams, that is huge. And your ability to impact the game. So thank you for all of that and all that you continue to do.

[00:02:00] Janet Marie Smith: Well, thank you for noting all of that. It is, it has truly been a pleasure. It's it's work, but what fun it is when it's over. 

[00:02:08] Mark Corbett: Well, and you've been acknowledged to, I mean, even the hall of fame has you installed up there with the Diamond Dreams. I believe it is acknowledging your achievement. So. Guys and gals, if you haven't been paying attention, there's a couple of places you can find this.

[00:02:23] Mark Corbett: Obviously you can look up Janet Marie Smith online, but if you had the good grace to, to go to Cooperstown, you can find her and other women who've achieved so much with the sport. 

[00:02:33] Janet Marie Smith: But 

[00:02:38] Mark Corbett: seriously, I mean, and I am serious about that. I appreciate all you've done. Okay. Let's get down to the nuts and bolts of things I'd like to know, Janet Marie.

[00:02:48] Mark Corbett: And that is one. Let's see. Like I said, you've, you've worked with Fenway, you worked with Camden Yards, and you were kind enough also to share with me a document that you've Talking about the vision of the game and you detailed three types of ballparks if I remember correctly, there was the classic one Uh, there was also the once as far as like an urban metro and what's the one i'm forgetting at the moment cheese and crackers 

[00:03:13] Janet Marie Smith: I think I I think I think what you're referring to is A conversation that I had at the spring training conference, known as 9 about ballparks.

[00:03:25] Janet Marie Smith: And, you know, I, I, I guess the planner in me always wants to organize things into categories. And I think at the time I was thinking, okay, whether the classic parks, they're the round multipurpose era. And then we have the single purpose buildings that started with guaranteed rate field, New Comiskey in Chicago in 1991, Camden Yards in 92, and then a succession of parks that opened after that.

[00:03:55] Janet Marie Smith: And it's been interesting, just as a casual historian to look back at all of those different. Genres of baseball and how they fit into the city or didn't and how they supported the sport or didn't 

[00:04:10] Mark Corbett: You're not just building a new stadium A lot of times you have to come in and you're doing renovations and certainly with fenway and camden you had A little bit more wide open.

[00:04:19] Mark Corbett: Cause you're starting fresh. Where do I start? I don't know. We have a little bit because there's a couple of things. Let's just stick with, with Camden yards for a moment. I know you got to work with Larry Latino there and he, we, we lost this year, but, uh, You know, he, he's a lightning rod with some fans.

[00:04:38] Mark Corbett: Some of you, they're 

[00:04:39] Janet Marie Smith: loving, he's a force. Well, you, you have to appreciate what Larry Lucchino did for baseball. The Camden yards was really the vision of Larry Lucchino, who is president of the Orioles wanted to create an old fashioned ballpark, one that had. Context fit in with the city had the intimacy of a Fenway, a shy of Forbes had the architectural characteristics of those classic ballparks.

[00:05:10] Janet Marie Smith: Thankfully, the oils work or supported at the time. By the governor of Maryland, William Donald Schaefer, who had been the former mayor of Baltimore. And his thing was, we have to have a new home for the Orioles. We lost the NFL Colts. We cannot lose our baseball team. How do we keep them here? We need a new, we need a new stadium.

[00:05:34] Janet Marie Smith: Larry was the 1 who said it had to be a ballpark shape. And so we need a new stadium, but he wanted it to be in Baltimore and to be part of the center city and be a part of the magnetic attraction that had become the inner harbor, the aquarium, the science center, and this idea that baseball would be 1 of the puzzle pieces to create an entertainment district downtown.

[00:05:58] Janet Marie Smith: goes back to those days of the late 1980s when those two gentlemen were looking to forge a path to keep the Orioles in Baltimore. 

[00:06:09] Mark Corbett: Well, and it wasn't something that just falls into place either because I think of, I thought of a question I heard from What view that was given to you in on another podcast and the question was, Hey, Janet Marie, if you could do whatever you wanted and you had all the timeline, all the money, you know, what would you do?

[00:06:27] Mark Corbett: And what I remember from your response was. I actually like working within the restrictions or limitatperions. 

[00:06:34] Janet Marie Smith: I do. I think it makes things so much more interesting when you have a tether to, uh, to a place and Camden Yards, though it was a ground up building. The act of saving the warehouse gave it this instant, timeless feeling and more could also save money.

[00:06:54] Janet Marie Smith: That's the other thing that's so important about preservation. It's not just about keeping history for the nostalgia sake there's often an addition to the obvious environmental benefits of not tearing things down and putting it into the landfill. 1 of the things that we were able to prove with the warehouse.

[00:07:12] Janet Marie Smith: Which, by the way, keeping that was very controversial when it first came up. There were many who said Camden Yards, we didn't have a name then, but, but the Camden Yards is the name of the site that the baseball park needed room to breathe, that the warehouse was going to choke it, that it wasn't going to have enough space around it to, to feel commodious and welcoming.

[00:07:37] Janet Marie Smith: There were some who were like, that old brick building who wants to say that there were others who objected to the fact that it blocked the sight lines of the downtown and presumably a glimpse of the water. But we felt very strongly that it did just the opposite that it not only grounded this idea, but if we were going to be faithful to Larry Lucchino's mantra of an old fashioned ballpark, we We wouldn't go in and tear down the very thing that gave it context.

[00:08:04] Janet Marie Smith: What made Ebbets field and Fenway Park Forbes feel so interesting is that their field dimensions were shaped by the block. They were on within the city. It's kind of the amazing thing about baseball is that the outfield dimensions can be whatever they want to be. Everyone wants it wants it to play there.

[00:08:22] Janet Marie Smith: You don't want to err on it being a hitters park or a pitchers park, but they're not uniform. And that's what makes baseball so interesting place to place. It's the there's a reason that people like you make a pilgrimage of going to all the ballparks. Nobody ever does that with an NBA arena or an NFL stadium.

[00:08:40] Janet Marie Smith: But the idea of the how baseball expresses itself is very much in its architecture. So this context, I think, makes it much more interesting. And then I admittedly love the challenge of. Things like Fenway and Dodger Stadium where it's like, okay, but we're still playing baseball here. How do we upgrade these buildings?

[00:09:04] Janet Marie Smith: In such a short amount of time in the off season between November and March. How do you make that happen? That too is a challenge and one that i've really enjoyed. 

[00:09:15] Mark Corbett: Well, you know, i'm looking right now At Camden Yards right now. There's changes actually being done. I'm looking at Dodger Stadium and it looks like there's excavation actually going on the field and also I can think of my goodness the changes that are happening and you've only got an off season to do some of this stuff.

[00:09:33] Mark Corbett: How do you even begin to plan for that? 

[00:09:36] Janet Marie Smith: Well, that is exactly what you do. You plan for it. You can't. Can't wake up at the end of the baseball season and say, oh, I think I'd like to renovate our clubhouse this offseason. You need to spend the season planning these things, getting all of your team lined up your architecture, contractors, your funding sources, your, uh, your permitting, even have a plan with the city for your inspections.

[00:10:02] Janet Marie Smith: You can't afford to fail. I often say in any project, there's sort of 3, you know, That there are 3 drivers, there's the schedule, there's the budget, and then there's the design as in the scope. What scale project are you doing? And these projects with baseball, if you're trying to play there, the schedule is really the driver.

[00:10:25] Janet Marie Smith: So you have to moderate. The scope of your project to fit that off season, sometimes you read about teams that are looking to renovate their building and they, you see the huge sums of money that are needed to keep the building maintained. And I know that's obviously born out of real studies that engineers have done, but there's a reality of how much you can spend in the off season.

[00:10:51] Janet Marie Smith: So you have to stagger these projects. So that they don't just build up to where you are forced to do everything in one breath. And I've never known a team to willingly move out and then move back in. I mean, perhaps they're extenuating circumstances as you all obviously are living through in Tampa. 

[00:11:10] Mark Corbett: Oh, yeah.

[00:11:13] Janet Marie Smith: That's another story in and of itself, but there are very few times that teams willingly leave their home to come back. You want to make certain that your fan base and your team feel like it's, it's, there's a. There is something to be said for the home field advantage, and it's not just financial. It's.

[00:11:32] Mark Corbett: Yeah, there, there's no doubt about that. And since you mentioned, I will touch a little bit on looking at right now, there are two teams in major league baseball that will not be returning to their traditional stadium this year. And we're talking about the Oakland Sacramento Vegas A's and the Tampa Bay, uh, St.

[00:11:53] Mark Corbett: Peter, uh, it's, it's been interesting. Um, Trying that I'll just briefly say as a fan of the race, it's going to be, I'm not going to get into all the mess that's going on. People could read about that somewhere else, but it's interesting that this year, they're going to be playing at a minor league field that is actually the spring training field for the New York Yankees, and it's going to be open air and with the heat and rain here, it's going to be a very challenging deal.

[00:12:20] Mark Corbett: But I'm looking across, let's set that to the side for a moment, looking across at what's actually developing. We're looking at expansion. Potentially an MLB. We're talking about Salt Lake City. We're talking about Montreal. Montreal's spending like over what I hate 140 million dollars right now for a new roof, a multi purpose stadium and are you by any chance, are you working with any of these projects?

[00:12:47] Mark Corbett: No, 

[00:12:47] Janet Marie Smith: no, I'm not working on any of those. 

[00:12:49] Mark Corbett: You are doing so much with with Dodger Stadium. What's going on with Dodger Stadium right now? I'm 

[00:12:54] Janet Marie Smith: Well, the most exciting thing that we're doing this off season is an expansion of the clubhouse and while on the surface of it, that may sound like we're knocking down a few walls and rearranging the furniture as you noted, there is a, there is an enormous excavation project underway with huge piles of dirt sitting in center field at the moment.

[00:13:17] Janet Marie Smith: Like most parts, the clubhouse at Dodger Stadium is below grade. And the way that building is carved into the hillside of Chavez Ravine means that there's no going back into the hills, like, literally no going back on the level that the clubhouse was originally on. So, as we did 12 years ago, when Guggenheim and their partners first bought the Dodgers.

[00:13:42] Janet Marie Smith: We're we took out the lower bowl seats and we're going down and adding square footage so that our clubhouse at Dodger Stadium will be essentially like, not just a split level house as it has been the last 12 years, but adding a 3rd level in order to get an additional batting cage and square footage for the kinds of things that the clubhouse.

[00:14:05] Janet Marie Smith: Uh, needed, um, accommodating women in the clubhouse, the ability to accommodate the mental health skills, the mental health coach, quiet rooms. Wow. I think 1 of the things that we're seeing in, uh, sports is a focus, not just on the athlete as, uh, as, as the horse, but how to care for that. The total person, and so an emphasis on nutrition and emphasis on the mental health is every bit as important today as the conditioning and training that we all we associate with batting cages, weight rooms, et cetera.

[00:14:44] Mark Corbett: Well, you know, I, I've had Perry Barber on the show as an umpire who's, and I think back of where you're talking about umpires had to change and what was available and such and, and a lot of accommodations or combination may be the wrong word for women. Who are participating in the game at different, whether it be an umpire, whether it be, uh, coming into the locker room and, and just having a conversation with the players.

[00:15:09] Mark Corbett: I'm glad I played a lot of that's been being addressed and I'm sure there's always going to be room for improvement. Well, it's 

[00:15:16] Janet Marie Smith: really important to think about as a total problem to solve. Also, Perry and I have talked over the years. She's, it's just amazing the field that she pioneered. And I, I. I feel like, uh, it's been a long time coming seeing women as empires in the major leagues.

[00:15:37] Janet Marie Smith: I can remember in the early 2000s, that's now 25 years ago. Major League Baseball looked in the mirror and said, we see it coming. And every building that opened in that, that 5 year span of 2000 to 2005. Was designing their umpire rooms to accommodate men to dress in one area, women to dress in another area, and often had a shared space for dining, playing cards, relaxing, strategizing about the game, and many of them, like Citizens Bank Park in Philadelphia, uh, PNC Park in Pittsburgh were beautifully laid out Not just to give women a place to dress, but to build camaraderie and to allow those who were umpiring to come together.

[00:16:26] Janet Marie Smith: But since no women were ever tapped to fill that role, the rooms got repurposed for coaches or mascots or something else. And it's rather disappointing as a sport that we haven't gotten there yet. But looking at the roster of women and who are now umpiring in the minor leagues and. In college, I suspect that will change.

[00:16:53] Mark Corbett: Well, yeah, I mean, I know talk with Perry and we've had conversations. I think we were both waiting for Jen Powell to come up last year as an umpire and didn't see that actually happen. And I was gritting my teeth all the way up to, till we got to the post season and was sorely disappointed in that particular, you know, the, the, nothing had happened there from last year, but, uh, you'll get me on a rant down there.

[00:17:18] Mark Corbett: Watch out. 

[00:17:19] Janet Marie Smith: Well, it is, it is a really interesting thing. And if you've ever spent any time with any women who have been in uniform and in a clubhouse, you can appreciate just how challenging it is to retrofit an existing clubhouse so that they feel welcome. It's not just a matter of where do you shower and change?

[00:17:39] Janet Marie Smith: It's how to design the spaces so that anyone can be in those spaces and doing what you naturally do, whether it's dining or. Building a game plan or reviewing video, and it just sort of feels natural to be there. And hopefully that has become more of a script in recent years. 

[00:18:02] Mark Corbett: Well, I know you're going to have to go here, Charlie, but I did want to ask you, looking at women in baseball, whether we were talking about Perry, where we're talking about, you know, with what you've achieved, where do you see more recent advancements coming for women?

[00:18:16] Mark Corbett: And what, what are your, your hopes and dreams? 

[00:18:18] Janet Marie Smith: Well, I think it's throughout sports, and I think if you look at sports, one of the obvious things is that there's so many disciplines within sports like sports is not a discipline. There's there's finance. There's legal. There's people resources. There's community relations.

[00:18:35] Janet Marie Smith: There's public relations and then, as you start to look at the baseball side, it 2 breaks down into so many things from nutrition to training to mental health. Just the, it, the number of disciplines that it takes to put together a team, both on the field strategy as well as the front office and the fan facing strategy is really phenomenal.

[00:19:04] Janet Marie Smith: And with our colleges being 50 percent women, 50 percent men with the diversity that we have throughout our industries, college, not being a prerequisite, just the work environment. I think there's so many opportunities for so many people and often sports are looking for someone from, from not from within.

[00:19:28] Janet Marie Smith: I don't think it's an insular industry either. I think some of the best ideas come from somewhere else. I'm a perfect case study. I don't even have a perfect case study, but I'm a good example of that. Like I didn't come from sports. my Interest in working for the Orioles was because they were building this downtown ballpark.

[00:19:47] Janet Marie Smith: And how did you take a piece of real estate? And turn it into something that made it feel like a place where people wanted to spend their leisure time, wanted to spend their entertainment dollars, wanted to bring their families, and they maybe weren't sports fans. Maybe they don't really hang on to every picture, keep score, but how do you create an environment where they want to be?

[00:20:10] Janet Marie Smith: And how do you make that part of the urban setting? But my knowledge base of that didn't come because I. Inherently new baseball. That was a bonus. It came from having worked in urban design and planning for so many years before I joined the Orioles. So I, I've always loved and admired professionals who don't just recycle ideas, but rather look at other other areas and draw inspiration from that.

[00:20:41] Mark Corbett: Whether it be from outside or inside. And I don't want to get too much into this, but I thought even when you were putting together Camden yards, you actually pulled somebody from the inside. You're looking at Frank Robinson to get a different kind of insight and perspective, but. No, looking 

[00:20:57] Janet Marie Smith: was the ultimate insider, but what better credibility could you have than to reach out to Frank Robinson, who was then the manager of the Orioles for advice on the ballpark?

[00:21:08] Janet Marie Smith: But I do just want to dwell on that for a moment because I've often felt that Frank Robinson. As our manager was our secret weapon on Camden Yards, because no matter that the vision of doing this old fashioned ballpark, uh, with the asymmetrical outfield and the small amount of territory came from the driving force that Luchino brought to it.

[00:21:31] Janet Marie Smith: That was such a novel idea that it took someone like Frank and his credibility to say, I can speak from experience. I played in those parks and there is a world of difference in the way the game is played and the way that fans respond to the game. In those parks, and of course, at the time, we still had Fenway and Wrigley as we do today is proof of that.

[00:21:56] Janet Marie Smith: And Larry would point to that. He would say, how can the 2 smallest parks in the major leagues be consistently drawing the highest attendance, no matter what their performance on the field. There's something to be said about the environment there. Yes, 

[00:22:11] Mark Corbett: there is. And 

[00:22:12] Janet Marie Smith: I've always loved remembering the way those 2 gentlemen and their convictions came together.

[00:22:20] Mark Corbett: Well, I just had to bring him up because I thought of while we're talking about the diversity of bringing people in from different types of businesses and mindsets, but to be able to integrate that with other folks who are actually maybe been in the trenches, so to speak, with a game like Frank Robinson.

[00:22:35] Mark Corbett: But when we're talking again about women, uh, I know in the past I've done some presentations and one of the people I was looking at in the past were people like Marty Ronski with the Brewers at the time, Carolyn Perry, I think with the San Diego Padres, Katie Griggs, she's with the, I think, President of Business Operations.

[00:22:54] Mark Corbett: Oh, that's right. Of 

[00:22:55] Janet Marie Smith: the Oils, yeah. That's right. Recently joined. All of Baltimore is excited about that. 

[00:23:00] Mark Corbett: Even locally. Well, since we got spring training everywhere, what's going over to Yankees, George Steinbrenner stadium and seeing Rachel back of that, that minor league team, but Kim Ang is to me, one of the most pivotal people.

[00:23:14] Mark Corbett: Cause I'm looking at this woman, she was a lawyer. She worked with them, major league baseball. She was with the Yankees with Brian Cashman. She negotiated the Eric Cole contract. Then she's with general manager with the Marlins. And now she's got a new venture coming up. I I've got to get into more details on this, but, uh, uh, it's, it's great to see women being able to expand and not just be set in a one position.

[00:23:39] Mark Corbett: And it gets, that's nice. We have a lady into the, in the club today. Okay. No, you've got a professional who's able to execute and making a difference. 

[00:23:48] Janet Marie Smith: I think you're right. I think the, the day that we don't have to point out that it's a woman is, um, going to be a wonderful day. 

[00:23:54] Mark Corbett: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[00:23:57] Mark Corbett: And speaking of thank you, I, do you have anything else you want to make sure we share? That's 

[00:24:01] Janet Marie Smith: fine. I enjoy the conversation. Thank you. 

[00:24:03] Mark Corbett: Well, it's been a pleasure having you. And just as a side note in your background, I see you've got Tony stone up here on the wall and I absolutely love her. I think quickly folks, Tony stone was like, to me now, if you look at it, she was the First woman in Major League Baseball because once the Negro Leagues were combined.

[00:24:21] Mark Corbett: With Major League Baseball, I believe Tony, because she was with the Indianapolis Clowns, are now part of Major League Baseball. So I love that. 

[00:24:30] Janet Marie Smith: Yeah, I do too. It's nice to have a pennant pinned up in my office to celebrate. 

[00:24:37] Mark Corbett: Kate, thank you enough. It's been a real pleasure having you here today. And I wish you a Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

[00:24:43] Mark Corbett: So Thank you, 

[00:24:45] Janet Marie Smith: Mark. I enjoyed the conversation. I look forward to seeing you in the spring when, when we all have a new roster, a new, a new opportunity to see how the season unfolds. 

[00:24:55] Mark Corbett: Amen. Sister. Amen. 

[00:24:58] Judith: That was Janet Marie Smith. Senior vice president of planning and development for the Los Angeles Dodgers.

[00:25:04] Judith: You have been listening to a Women in Baseball edition of BaseballBiz On Deck, with special guest, Janet Marie Smith, Senior Vice President of Planning and Development for the Los Angeles Dodgers. 

 Special Thanks to Gianna Danese & Rick Vaughn for making this episode possible.

Thank you all for listening and remember , you can find Mark at @baseballbizondeck.bsky.social You may also find Baseball Biz on Deck, on iHeart, Apple, Spotify, Amazon Music, and at baseball biz on deck.com.

Tags: Camden Yards,Orioles Park, Fenway,Dodgers Stadium, WIB, Women in Baseball, Architect, Urban Planning, Ballparks, Stadiums, Battery Park, Mississippi State, New York, renovation, Rose Bowl, Canopy, Rickwood, Diamond Dreams, Cooperstown, Toni Stone, Perry Barber, Rick Vaughn

Janet Marie Smith, architect, urban planner & Senior Vice President of Planning and Development for the Los Angeles Dodgers.