RaysUp - Who is moving out & up + St. Pete Stadium realities for Tampa Bay Rays

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[00:00:00] Mark Corbett: Welcome to   on deck. I am Mark Corbett and with me, of course, is Mr. Mat Germain. And we're going to take a look at what's going on in that special world of the Tampa Bay Rays. Hey, Mat, if you've been looking at this, I mean. This is not what I expected to see after a quarter of a season gone, brother.

[00:00:27] Mat Germain: Yeah, it's been , it's been lackluster, I guess is what you would say. Overall, they, they're, they're overcoming a lot of hurdles and , and some of them they're not clearing completely. 

[00:00:40] Mark Corbett: Well, I think that's accurate enough and we know injuries have been played a part of it and I gotta tell you, I've always been in the mindset while I hear other teams say, well, our guys are injured.

[00:00:50] Mark Corbett: That's go tell it to somebody else, but I'm no sympathy, but deal with, with you and I've said time and again, with basically a full rotation of, of  , pitchers that are on the sideline that it has, has, it's been difficult, but I think we've seen some like this past week for some of that pitching. I mean, I saw Civale the other day and I thought he did a decent job.

[00:01:18] Mat Germain: Yeah. Civale, I still think his pitch mix is, is off.  , but he, he was a lot sharper than he had been. And I think , he knows that his job is basically, you know, to, to go out there and shove as much as he can so he can eat, chew up as many innings as possible , And he, this stuff is there. He's just, to me, he needs to locate better when he misses.

[00:01:42] Mat Germain: If he does that, then he's not going to get hurt as much , when he does. 

[00:01:47] Mark Corbett: Well, I said, I thought he was looking better. I'm looking forward to watching Taj tonight and I've got TV on the other room. I haven't looked at what's going on. You, can you see the screen from where you're at? What's the score right now?

[00:01:58] Mat Germain: Yep. It's one, nothing for the Red Sox. It was a sacrifice flop.  , Taj looks great though. I, I, I love the way the ball is coming out of his hand so far , since he's come back , even in triple a. And I think he's going to be a game changer and when Pepio and him are going strong, I'm hoping they can get a good stretch of both of them healthy at the same time.

[00:02:20] Mat Germain: And I think that's when the race start picking up steam.  , so really excited with this start today. So hopefully he settles down after that one run because the rays aren't going to score many off of Tanner hook. I don't think. 

[00:02:33] Mark Corbett: Yeah, he's a tough one. And with Taj, I remember early on him talking of the mindset is he pitched each ball by that.

[00:02:42] Mark Corbett: I mean, He didn't look backward. He didn't look forward. He just was like, okay, whatever that just pitched. If it was fantastic, it was great. If it wasn't, then that's fine too. I've gotta make this next, this next pitch, you know, be a strike. I gotta make sure that it's effective. And he didn't seem the kind of person who would sit inside of his head over a bad pitch, 

[00:03:03] Mat Germain: right?

[00:03:04] Mat Germain: That's one big difference between him and Blake Snell. And the other one is that I think he , he, he has. A complete awareness that he can throw his stuff in the strike zone without having to worry about it. Whereas Blake Snell almost completely needs to convince himself to throw strikes on occasion.

[00:03:24] Mark Corbett: So 

[00:03:26] Mat Germain: a few different styles, and I love the potential. I really see Taj Bradley eventually as being an ace , on the staff.  , I know last year he frustrated some fans with, with some of the , the down starts that he had.  , but I think him and Ryan Pepio are really exciting front runner guys. 

[00:03:47] Mark Corbett: Well, I'm looking forward to seeing more of him and we've been fortunate.

[00:03:50] Mark Corbett: I mean, last week we were talking about John DeLuca and certainly with Mr. JLo coming back and seeing what Josh could do. Yeah, my goodness. We had some energy going out there. Air what Randy Rosarito seems to be waking up. 

[00:04:03] Mat Germain: Yeah. Yeah. He's looking good. The, we, the, the bat speeds back, which I love to see because it wasn't there in April at all.

[00:04:11] Mat Germain: I don't know what. Technical thing he's changed. They remember , recently , Harold Ramirez was being interviewed and he said that he dropped his hands and held them closer to his body. And just to be able to get the bat out there quicker.  , I don't know exactly what technical things went along with that in terms of timing, but it almost seems like Randy Roseraine is doing that.

[00:04:36] Mat Germain: So he's catching a ball ahead , compared to what he was doing earlier in the year, which was really being late on most pages. 

[00:04:44] Mark Corbett: Well, I'm glad to see, like I said, Randy coming back, Siri seems to be still iffy. I mean, he's had what he had a home run the other day and. I don't know. What do you think he's going to be getting back to his regular self here soon?

[00:04:59] Mat Germain: It's hard to say he's such a, the talent's there, everybody sees the talent. So that's the frustrating part is, you know , if he was more of a contact oriented guy, he could hit home runs at a decent rate still, and, and be a really Almost maybe a four tool outfielder right in center field with plus power.

[00:05:21] Mat Germain: So he'd be a really valuable component, but at this point, just watching the Red Sox series and we see , their, their shortstop slash center fielder.  , Rafaela, I think.  , there's a chance that Jose Caballero and ends up doing the same kind of thing at some point where he plays some shortstop and possibly center field.

[00:05:42] Mat Germain: And I'd be curious to see if Caballero can, you know, split time with Johnny DeLuca just because they both have better, you know, More. I shouldn't say better. They have more consistent at bats, you know, through months. And I think that's the first frustrating part with Jose Siri is he tends to have long stretches where they're not really productive at bats.

[00:06:06] Mat Germain: And then he'll have a few really good at bats.  , and, and that'll drive managers nuts over time too. So it's hard to say, I wouldn't bet either way. I wouldn't bet for or against them. 

[00:06:19] Mark Corbett: I'm looking forward. Like I say, I hope to see Siri coming back strong. I mean, know we still have plenty of gas in IL and no, you showed some more information on Mr.

[00:06:28] Mark Corbett: Brenda McKay the other day and I thought, I can't believe that the Rays. I wish him well. I actually, I very much so, 'cause I know the man's trying, but the body just sometimes won't let you do what you need to do. 

[00:06:42] Mat Germain: I don't understand the focus with the starting pitching , come back , I don't know if it would have been any different if it was in relief.

[00:06:50] Mat Germain: I, I think it might , I've heard differing things on from experts on , on how hard it is to be a relief because you have to have, you know, Do things more consistently, you don't get as much rest time period. So it's a little bit of a different tempo, but , I, I would do wish I'm like you. I wish him the best too, because he's, he's worked his tail off to try to get back to this point.

[00:07:15] Mat Germain: So when he, that 60 day IL news came out, I was crushed for him. 

[00:07:21] Mark Corbett: Yeah, that's. I don't know what to help. I mean, what's going to happen for the, that poor fella, you know, but , let's kind of scoot back here and look at last night's game. I thought we were going to be able to win that one brother. I mean, he's looking good, you know?

[00:07:38] Mat Germain: Yeah. And I know some people like to point at the Manuel Rodriguez play. As the reason, but it's more than that. Honestly, Mark, like there was opportunities for them to win the game before that. And they just didn't capitalize or they had a runner on third with one out. They'd never drove in.  , they had , guys getting caught stealing bases when they had no business trying to steal a base.

[00:08:00] Mat Germain: It wasn't even their fastest guys doing it. So there was a lot of ingredients in that game that were frustrating for me, but, you know, generally, like, when you look at the game, you look at standing back from it, you're like, yeah, it was a competitive game and they could have won it. So it's hard to get, I don't mind losing those games.

[00:08:19] Mat Germain: The ones that I hate losing are the ones where they do weird things with the personnel that they use near the end of the game, and then they drive themselves away from the possibility of a win. Those to me are the more frustrating ones. So last night was, it was fun to get some extra innings, but frustrating that we definitely didn't come out on top, but still entertaining.

[00:08:41] Mark Corbett: Let's see. I was curious because you mentioned still in basis and sometimes it's just plain sloppy or you, you really have no business doing that. If we're looking at teams. I looked the other day, I don't have it in front of me at the moment, but the team that had the most stolen bases, I saw the other day was the reds and they still got some work to do.

[00:09:03] Mark Corbett: So, still in basis, don't they? They're great entertainment. They, but they don't necessarily equate to wins and it's, it's gotta be smart. You know, when you do it, 

[00:09:14] Mat Germain: I don't 

[00:09:14] Mark Corbett: know. 

[00:09:15] Mat Germain: And that's why I like the, the, it's, it's, it's called the base running , Runs above average from , fan graphs. It'll tell you how well a team is running the bases.

[00:09:27] Mat Germain: So whether or not they're doing things intelligently or not, because it'll kind of include more information than just simply stolen bases.  , and it'll, you know, how often do you take 1st to 3rd? How often do you do this? Do that? And how many opportunities did you miss? Overall, the Rays are about midway point in the league, generally, right?

[00:09:50] Mat Germain: So they're always somewhere between the 15th and 18th position in the rankings. And that's that. And a lot of it is because of that, because they take chances at the least opportune times and end up taking the bat out of the hands of the guy that's at the plate. And that's the frustrating part is sometimes I think, you know, they, they, by doing that, you're lowering the pitch count of the pitcher that's on the mound.

[00:10:15] Mat Germain: And so you're, especially when you're doing against a starter and like I met Rosario last night, it was a good example. He had no business. It was, it was no outs. He was on first base. You don't need to, you don't need to push the envelope. You're not a base dealer to begin with. It's not like he has plus plus speed.

[00:10:31] Mat Germain: So just wait for your opportunities and wear down the picture so that you can get to the pen earlier. Right. To me, that's more important than trying to steal that one base , in certain places, especially in tight games, especially when you know that the guy behind the plate has a really good arm and then can use it really well.

[00:10:49] Mat Germain: If it was a weak catcher, like when we were playing the Mets, yeah, I get it. They're they're running a stopping game is. Terrible. It doesn't. So go ahead, run wild, do what you need to do. But  , in tight games with a really strong catcher behind the plate, I think they did it against the Brewers as well.  , they were running on Contreras like crazy.

[00:11:07] Mat Germain: I was like, yeah, what are you doing? Like, and they got caught and they got caught and it was just getting frustrating. Some guys can have the green light all the time. Jose Caballero, steal whenever you want. Jose Siria, his j ps are not really great, so I still would give him the, what I would call the yellow light, right?

[00:11:27] Mat Germain: Where, yeah, just check with us and we'll either okay it or not, sort of thing. But the whole theory with the rays giving everybody the green light, I think that's a problem. I think that needs to change and it, it, it, you can't, first of all, it takes that control out of Kevin Cash and the race's hands and it jeopardizes the run production and the control over the game and the flow of the game, which is his job, to be quite honest, is to manage the flow of the game.

[00:11:58] Mat Germain: I think it's a mistake because I, you see it too often that guys run in the worst position , possible spots. Randy's been culpable of doing that on occasion. So , hopefully somebody whispers something in somebody's ear and kind of clamps down on it a little bit just so they're a little bit smarter about it.

[00:12:19] Mark Corbett: Yeah, that's. You know, the Mr. 10 years manager, it's, it's things where he needs to be doing. I mean, that's one of the ones, it seems like that's actually your call, Kevin. You get to tell him, you know, come on, man.  , madness. But , all in all it's I've been, I've enjoyed the game. I'm joined the team. We're right underneath 500.

[00:12:42] Mark Corbett: And we've got some work for us. I know you and I were talking about the AL East because that's a lot of what's been going on with us last week and next week to boot. See, we, we finished up with the Yankees. We're working with the Red Sox. We got the Blue Jays and we've got the Red Sox again. It's going to be fun times here for the next, well, next week or so.

[00:13:03] Mark Corbett: So , I don't think, what do you think when we finally face up at the Blue Jays? Do you think that's going to be a. Easier path than what we have right now with the Red Sox and finishing up with the Yankees 

[00:13:15] Mat Germain: The pitching matchups aren't ideal to be quite honest, because you got Alexander starting it and Civale finishing it.

[00:13:22] Mat Germain: And I know both of them might end up struggling against the The Jays lineup doesn't scare anybody away, but the aggressiveness of the Rays in pitching to the guys that they probably shouldn't be pitching to in certain moments tells me they're going to challenge them. And so, Yeah, basically, they're going to be dependent on the lineup to perform.

[00:13:42] Mat Germain: And right now, tonight, they have the optimal kind of setting where they've got right, left, right, left, right, left, all the way down. And I love that, that kind of tempo , especially against the righty. So they finally have put in all of their left handed hitters , including Johnny Aranda, which, you know, I, I feel really bad for Austin Chen.

[00:14:03] Mat Germain:  , I think he would have performed a heck of a lot better than a lot of people that ended up taking , his, his, what should have been his at bats in the lineup over the month of April, but I don't feel completely bad for him. Do you know why, Mark? 

[00:14:19] Mark Corbett: Because he's not ripe enough yet. 

[00:14:21] Mat Germain: No, because he made 200 grand to sit on the bench.

[00:14:24] Mat Germain: Oh, good point. Which is probably more than he's ever made in the minors or signed for. Right. So he made good money to kind of learn his crafts. Hopefully that helps them to, Really light up AAA and, and find his role with another team. I, I don't think the Rays are serious about giving him a shot.  , how can I be like, they didn't give him any at bats.

[00:14:48] Mat Germain: And when the, when he did, it was in the most high pressured situations 

[00:14:52] Mark Corbett: and 

[00:14:52] Mat Germain: he still performed well, but it's, I don't think he was treated fairly at all. And I'll, I'll stick to that. 

[00:15:00] Mark Corbett: Well, you know, and we, we talked about it when he came up because he was just getting ready to put money down on an apartment in Durham and we're saying, yeah, I think he could probably afford it now, but , for both of them.

[00:15:12] Mark Corbett: But yeah, so yeah, he's got that in the pocket. I hope, you know, you hope something like this doesn't cripple the ability to be marketable, if you will, for the future, I don't think it will. I really don't. 

[00:15:24] Mat Germain: If anything, it'll promote him because. He took it. He did it all with, with , there was no , I don't think  , frustration from his part that came across anywhere.

[00:15:36] Mat Germain: And like I said, his at bats were stellar. Depend the, despite getting only 43 of them over the course of a quarter season, which is ridiculous.  , I think he was on pace for 172 at bats over the course of a full season at the pace he's going. So not only were the play, the Rays purposely short changing themselves, In a lineup that could have been more optimal, but the, they obviously didn't trust any other assets more than they trusted Austin or didn't want, it's just weird.

[00:16:12] Mat Germain: There's a lack of faith in the Rays roster in the way they're operating right now. That is, it's not like anything I've ever seen the last five years. And it's kind of throwing me off a little bit, to be honest. 

[00:16:25] Mark Corbett: Well, as far as throwing things off, I don't know whether to go ahead and transition down to the rays coming back because you got to have a home to come back to man.

[00:16:36] Mark Corbett: You do. And there's been a lot of question marks about where the razor bit. I, I did a little bit of history , scholarship, if you will, digging in and saying, okay, I wanted to find out. What's been the path of the race in the, in the trap, you know, and what's the future hold or what was the outline where we thought was going to be the future.

[00:16:56] Mark Corbett: And you look at them, let's see, man, you look at the trap and they, they got that put together in the hopes of having a baseball team, you know, initially the trap was used by the thunder. It was the Thunderdome.  , it was used for arena football all that time where I'm trying to get MLB to give an extension team to Tampa.

[00:17:18] Mark Corbett: You know, when we finally got one and then if you're looking at the people around it, let's see, Stu came in, I think just around 20 years ago, it was May, it may have been May, 2004, where he came in and got like a 45% , Part of the business, if you will, the race. So, you know, at that point, you're saying it's his now it's his to go ahead and do some things formative, I guess.

[00:17:47] Mark Corbett: Let's see then about seven years later, we're looking 2007 and what , she's trying to figure this out. You know, what happened in 2007, they were looking at putting another stadi  together and it wasn't more than a couple miles away. They were looking at the St. Pete waterfront down there, I guess, where our laying stadi  is, and that was going to be the new stadi .

[00:18:17] Mark Corbett: What's interesting about that, Mat, is it had the support of the governor of Florida to help find funds for it. I wouldn't have that today, no, no, no, but within a couple of years, I think they even had the same company Heinz they were working within, but , they said, nope, it's not going to work. Didn't wasn't going to happen.

[00:18:44] Mark Corbett: And then you wait a few more years and they start talking about Ybor over here on the Tampa side of the water. I was excited about that. I don't know about you. Do you remember that big, giant glass roof they were going to have? 

[00:18:59] Mat Germain: I thought it was awesome that it had a statement. It, it, it would have had a personality that kind of , drew people to it.

[00:19:07] Mat Germain: It would have been a must. Go visit, right? If, if it came to fruition, 

[00:19:12] Mark Corbett: yeah, it really would have. I, I don't think there was room around there to develop a whole neighborhood or business. There could have been, I suppose, but there's so much historic around the Ybor and how much, how much that , baseball actually grew out of that area.

[00:19:27] Mark Corbett: A lot of what the immigrants who came over here and working in the tobacco factories, but yeah, it would have been neat to have that there. I, I was sad when it didn't happen, but that's, that's where it goes. And then what's the next thing we see? We're looking at the next solution is to split the team half of a year here and half of a year in Montreal.

[00:19:48] Mark Corbett: I don't know. I couldn't stand that idea. I mean, either I have a team or I don't. 

[00:19:54] Mat Germain: I think honestly, like I covered that entire time very closely, and , I think it was a test by Major League Baseball. It wasn't actually meant to go through in that case. It was a, it was a test and for two reasons. N ber one, I don't think Montreal ownership group that they, that was talking to Stu about this believes that they can afford a team on their own.

[00:20:17] Mat Germain: I think the price tag is too high for them. It's unpalatable. So they were looking at different options and they needed to test that idea out to see, first of all, how well the team would perform. The Montreal group would be vetted, and so they did that, and how much the political system in Quebec would actually support the Montreal group, and they saw that, so they were willing to pony up all the money that they needed, and all the help that they were asking for, with no questions asked.

[00:20:45] Mat Germain: So, Now they know what they need to know about the Montreal group and I still believe when expansion comes around that sister city concept may come back into the fold as options so that it can include more cities. So if you're looking to expand to 32 cities, why not 33? You know, they, they're starting with nothing, then it's a completely different scenario than what the rays we're dealing with, which is essentially losing half a season , or a half of a half.

[00:21:13] Mat Germain: So a quarter season of games , to another city, whereas for the other. Group coming in, if it's for expanded expansion team, like let's say it's Nashville and Montreal that split a team, then you could have 41 games in one city and 40 games in the other, and then deal with whatever you need to deal with playoff wise.

[00:21:31] Mat Germain:  , so I think that's what that was about because it made no sense to, to try to get fans to continue supporting a team when you know, they're playing in a different province or different area region altogether, half the year. 

[00:21:45] Mark Corbett: It was, it would be much more difficult for a team that already has a team, like you said, instead of somebody who doesn't have water to offer that, that solution and the Bronfman's, I thought.

[00:21:55] Mark Corbett: I thought they might find the money up there to have another Montreal Expos, but I guess not. And MLB may not have been ready for it either, as you were pointing out. So testing the waters, but then, then we said, okay. After a bit of time in 2018, one of the things I was looking at, I know was an article by John Romano with the Tampa Bay times.

[00:22:20] Mark Corbett: And if I read nothing else of it, the headline kind of said it all. The first thing the Rays need to build is consensus. And I think that's been the most difficult part for the Rays all through this journey for a new stadi . And it certainly was in Tampa. It doesn't seem like it's been as difficult a path in St.

[00:22:44] Mark Corbett: Pete. But this isn't something you just decide on and turn it around in six months. 

[00:22:51] Mat Germain: Right. And I think the way that I read it all is, okay, Stu was, was basically stuck into the lease of the trough. He had all that entire length of time to try a, B, C, D, E, all the way through to Z, all the different scenarios and try to see what worked and what didn't.

[00:23:10] Mat Germain: So he had time, he, he didn't have any rush or, you know, I, any reason to rush the process because he couldn't get out of the lease anyway, nobody was going to let him out. Yeah. So. He retested some things, and I think that, more than anything, aggravated a lot of fans, a lot of politicians, and a lot of, so there was sometimes a slow, non aggressive, completely off standish style, which I think ended up biting him in Ebor, and then there was the, the, the result of that, which was trying to aggressively aggressively aggressively.

[00:23:44] Mat Germain: You know chase the same dream and then that didn't work. So then it shifted all the way back to st. Petersburg, but I think I wouldn't read too much into everything that's played out until now now is more of a consistent Okay, we want to pRays the area. We want to we're not putting up banners about sister city stuff.

[00:24:05] Mat Germain: We're not you know We're focusing solely on st. Petersburg because everybody else has told us that we're not You  , they're, they're not going to play the game, right. In terms of , helping out with financing and other things that they need help with. 

[00:24:24] Mark Corbett: And that has, that's very accurate. I got to say that I probably have more sympathy for the ownership of the Rays than I ever thought I ever would.

[00:24:31] Mark Corbett: After digging in deeper on all the, the hoops they've gone through, you know, whether I agreed with some of the things or not, I felt like the, the effort's been made there.  , yeah, I know you and I were bantering back and forth. On Twitter the other day. And, and one of the things I was talking about is like, yeah, you need a project manager for this, somebody who can bring all the pieces together.

[00:24:53] Mark Corbett: And I, I started looking at it, man. And I thought, my gosh , there's, there's just so many pieces. I mean, the scope and size of this project, when you figure. There's actually two elements to this whole piece over in St. Pete. I mean, there's the stadi  and then there's the economic development, you know, which is going to have housing, a muse  and, and other facilities as well, but I cannot even begin to imagine putting that together and looking at the resources I went back.

[00:25:25] Mark Corbett: And I found an interview with Brian Auld on the day that they were pretty much endorsing the whole idea and there had been an agreement with St. Pete about having the Rays there. It was back January 30th , 2023. And it was interesting because I felt he, you know, so many times I listened to these front office guys and I feel like they, they say things they should.

[00:25:53] Mark Corbett: And I felt like, yeah, all in all, in that instance, I thought that man did a pretty good job. I'm going to play a bit here from that particular bit. And let's see, it was actually a lady by the name of Colleen Wright with the Tampa Bay Times asking this question. So I'm going to go ahead and play that now.

[00:26:10] Colleen Wright:  , Colleen Wright with the Tampa Bay Times.  , today Mayor Ken Walsh in his Q& A session , after his decision said that the Rays and the City of St. Petersburg are now engaged. So does this mean that the Rays are committed to staying and playing in St. Petersburg past 2027? And , and that you will cut off discussions with Tampa and Hillsborough?

[00:26:30] Colleen Wright: Or do the Rays intend on continuing due diligence on a possible e book 

[00:26:35] Brian Auld: city state? But we are fully engaged with St. Petersburg, and we intend to , work aggressively going forward to meet all expectations the city has in terms of timeline and hurdles along the way. But as we talked about , we are at the very beginning here, and there's a lot that still needs to go right for us to , to get a shovel in the ground.

[00:26:52] Brian Auld: Up until that shovel is in the ground. It's important that we continue to have dialogue about preserving the rays in Tampa Bay for generations to come and all the different ways that that could happen.  , but I don't want to underestimate what a big step was taken forward today. It's like Petersburg and Pinellas County.

[00:27:08] Colleen Wright: So still looking at Tampa. 

[00:27:10] Brian Auld: We're continuing the dialogue. 

[00:27:13] Mark Corbett: So Mat , she was very candid in her questions to Brian and I felt like he was pretty direct. And then when she did her follow up and saying, basically, are you, are you done with Tampa? Have you closed that door? And he said, no, he didn't, he didn't say quite that bluntly, but things aren't completed yet.

[00:27:34] Mark Corbett: And to me, that's good business strategy. And as a fan, you're just like sitting there. Oh my gosh, I thought we were good. I thought we had a someplace in St. Pete. Are you saying you're still open to something in Tampa? 

[00:27:46] Mat Germain: There's always the, the, the , possibility that certain demands or certain things, parameters will change in a deal that makes St.

[00:27:54] Mat Germain: Petersburg unpalatable at some point. So you always have to keep that other door open for sure. That's closing doors is never going to help any business person or our team. 

[00:28:05] Mark Corbett: No. And, and going back to the project management model for a moment. You know, when you have to pull all this together and it's like I said, almost two projects going on and you have to look at the resources that you have and the resources that you're dependent upon for other stakeholders, if you will, whether it be the Heinz group, who's working with the Rays, whether it's the county officials in Pinellas, the , the board people for the St.

[00:28:33] Mark Corbett: Pete, the council, there's just so many different people who have to bring something, even if it's just a yes. Vote to the whole thing. And I shudder to think the people who are working with us daily, it must've been like a, an ice Jenga, you know, where the pieces could melt immediately as soon as you put them up there and touch them.

[00:28:54] Mark Corbett: But I thought they did pretty well. 

[00:28:58] Mat Germain: I think that overall, the writers and the, the people, the people who have been monitoring this whole process the whole time have been pretty fair with the race. I, I think some of them might have a vendetta in some cases, but there are very few though.  , overall, I think most of the articles that you're pointing to and most of the questions being asked are fair and they're very , They're very pertinent to what the rays are doing.

[00:29:24] Mat Germain: So overall, I think the coverage for this has been really strong. 

[00:29:28] Mark Corbett: The coverage definitely has, and it's timely too, because as we were talking about, there's two different elements for the disagreement. One of them being the economic development and the other being the stadi . If the council really hasn't had a full viewing of this until they had a workshop last week.

[00:29:46] Mark Corbett: Where they sat down and everybody went over everything for like eight hours. So they, I don't know if they gave them bathroom breaks or not, but they stayed in there and they were going to answer all the questions they could. And some of the questions were rather poignant too. They were like, okay, now if the owner of the Rays decides to leave before the 30 year contract, what obligations will that.

[00:30:10] Mark Corbett: Owner previous owner have to this agreement with financials, et cetera, things of that nature. Then there was also, you and I were talking before the show, some questions about what measures or penalties, whether it be, if we're looking at affordable housing, that is part of that economic development. If not, if there is not a certain amount available, what happens to the , The owners of the Rays at that point, because that is part of the agreement.

[00:30:39] Mark Corbett: There's parts of the agreement saying who gets to decide where that affordable housing is located. So there's still questions that need to be answered and feel like they're all moving in the right direction. Everything i'm seeing there's these eight council people. There's two of them. Right now that seem one of them is definitely solidly against it.

[00:30:57] Mark Corbett: Probably two. So they need five council votes and it's looking like they're going to get them. Mat. 

[00:31:05] Mat Germain: I'm hoping they do because there's a lot of , you know, you can look at this project, this whole entire thing in a lot of different ways, but the way that I feel about it is St. Petersburg is looking for an identity upgrade basically, where they're, they're looking to really amp up.

[00:31:26] Mat Germain: Their, their situation overall. And they have a willing business partner in this case, in the race who happened to have a stake in the development as well. If they were to, if this were to fall through, let's say it does for whatever reason, and Stu sells the team to a Nashville interest and the Nashville interest takes the race.

[00:31:49] Mat Germain: Okay. Now Stu still owns part of the development rights in the area. What do you do? You know, who's going to invest. Upwards of 500, you know, 500 million to 600, 700 million, depending on how you want to read it into that area. And what are you going to put there? That's going to be a significant draw or significant, you know, center portion to your, your city.

[00:32:16] Mat Germain: So I think a lot of people, a lot of times will sit back and say, well, we should be doing this, this, this, this, this with the money. Yeah, but then you're out of money and what's bringing more money in? So unless there's a better opportunity, unless there's another investor saying, if you don't do the Rays, we're going to do this, this, and this.

[00:32:34] Mark Corbett: Right. 

[00:32:35] Mat Germain: Then you're really only looking at the Rays. They are your one opportunity, especially with Stu holding part of the cards in that front. So he sort of has their feet to the fire a little bit, and he's been able to live , A little bit more dangerously because of that.  , so I, I think it's an interesting situation overall.

[00:32:56] Mat Germain: I, I really do, but I think like you say that unless something really significant happens where.  , there's there begins to be a battle for one thing or the other There's nothing in this proposal or disagreement that that seems to me to point to   anything of disinterest and I will say that the You you had like the the first version and the second version in the doc ent that you sent me earlier today   of of what the n bers look like and it looks to me like the rays have taken on a little bit more of the Financial hit than was in the original offer You So there was, like, the cost overruns in certain cases would be on their books.

[00:33:37] Mat Germain:  , there was an additional 53 million, I think, that was added to a certain part of the development so that they would be covering it instead of it coming from the city, which I think lowered the city's portion by 20 million. Down from 130 150 million down to 130 million.  , so anyways, there's there's some financial aspects that have shifted around to the point where the rays are taking a little bit more weight than they were in the original proposal, and I think anytime they do that, it does help their cause and being seen as,  .

[00:34:15] Mat Germain: Anonymous broker in the deal sort of thing. 

[00:34:18] Mark Corbett: Well, instead of just trying to steamroll over the community and yes, exactly. If you see somebody willing to pony up a little bit more to be participating with it. Yeah. I think it does give them more a favorable appearance and makes the whole deal more palatable as well.

[00:34:33] Mark Corbett: A politician can go back to their constituents and say, Hey, guess what? We've got the Rays to give us this much more. So, you know, and we're going to be able to do this much more with the money. So those sorts of things are encouraging. Let's see. You know, the other part I was talking about, they've had the workshop now on the gas plant, on the economic development, and so we were talking about the other project, and that's having the workshop on the stadi .

[00:35:00] Mark Corbett: And Mat, what I've read thus far is they still have like about 11 doc ents that still need to be sent. Oh, and particulars, yeah. That workshop is going to take place on June the 13th and what this is interesting because they are going to close the workshop at 4 p. m. and 5 p. m. They're going to have their first reading about what's going to happen with it.

[00:35:27] Mark Corbett: Then on July 2nd. Is when they anticipate having a second reading and that possibly will have the earliest vote together would be in mid July, deciding on both of these programs and getting it done. 

[00:35:42] Mat Germain: So if you were building a house and you needed to hire contractors today. Right. Let's say that you wanted to build a house in July.

[00:35:50] Mat Germain: Could you get contractors set for July? 

[00:35:55] Mark Corbett: Oh, that's the thing. 

[00:35:57] Mat Germain: It's a thin line that they're running is all I'm going to say. Like, if you're looking at mid July, you're trying to get this locked up and all the I's dotted and the T's crossed, there must be a, some sort of , another level that it needs to go through state wise, would it?

[00:36:14] Mat Germain: In terms of like a, I don't know what kinds of approvals they would need to kind of chime in on. 

[00:36:19] Mark Corbett: I don't think state, but there is County. There is the Pinellas County. And as of the moment, some of the things I've seen have been positive from the Pinellas County commissioners. So I don't think so necessarily with the state.

[00:36:33] Mark Corbett: Here's a thought now. All of this has been going on since, gee, since 2007. The Rays have been working with Heinz, which is the company who's doing a lot for the development of this whole neighborhood and the stadi . You know, they've worked with them since 2007 on building some of the, the projects they were going to do.

[00:36:55] Mark Corbett: They've worked with a company with Populous, who's also helping in looking at some of those pieces together. We're looking at companies who've been part of this initiative For a decade or two, and I would like to think that they have the means, the wherewithal and the connections to be able to snap the fingers and start being able to bring everybody in to make this happen.

[00:37:19] Mark Corbett: Now, maybe I'm just living in Disneyland, but I think it's possible. And I'll, I'll give you an example and it's not valid, but I'm going to give it to you anyway.  , well, after I have home at night, there's been rough roads on I 4 for a while. Well, they suddenly started to fix them. And I would come out and I would see all these giant machines on the side of the road and they would come out and they would strip out the entire road and put down a new one practically overnight, like a mile at a time.

[00:37:53] Mark Corbett: And it was like, I didn't know that was possible. Well, I'm, I'm hoping that same kind of construction can translate into something they can pull together, you know, both on paper and in.  , construction when it comes to this race stadi  and I know they'd like to have about 2027, 

[00:38:11] Mat Germain: right? So you would hope that Heinz would have the connections , to, because when you think about it, you're building a stadi .

[00:38:18] Mat Germain: The first thing you do is dig a hole, right? So, so a lot of the groundwork and the, you know, I know there's a lot of environmental concerns. I think that is the hurdle that I'm. I'm more concerned about is I know a lot of big developments like that. They have a lot of watershed and different things that they need to do.

[00:38:36] Mat Germain: For the water runoff and all the environmental concerns that go along with that, that need to get sorted out. And sometimes it can be lengthy. There can be challenges to it. So I don't know what kind of powers they have in, in , In Florida itself, but it has been, you know, an issue that needs longer attention in some cases.

[00:38:56] Mat Germain: So hopefully Heinz has, has all that sorted out and kind of planned ahead, but , you wouldn't want it to delay much because right now they're, if you're looking at November, possibly getting shovels in the ground, that's November, 2024. And you're looking at three years. So by November, 2027, right. You'd be at the three year mark.

[00:39:17] Mat Germain: Yeah. And , and they'd be kind of wanting to get access to the stadi  by what February at a minim .  , so yeah, it doesn't leave much room for error is what I'm saying. 

[00:39:30] Mark Corbett: And maybe we can play in Sacramento for a year. I don't know. 

[00:39:33] Mat Germain: Or in Montreal, or Montreal, better yet. 

[00:39:38] Mark Corbett: Oh, oh, you know , I will say one more thing about the environment though.

[00:39:42] Mark Corbett: That did see something from the Sierra club and while they had some criticism, it wasn't damning. It was more like, here's some things we think maybe you ought to consider and some changes that should be made. It wasn't like, Oh, you know, this is going to impact everything and you need to stop immediately.

[00:40:00] Mark Corbett: And this cannot be built. It was more instructional. And , I won't say sympathetic, that's the wrong word, but maybe try to work together, coordinate with them. So we'll see that being said, my friend. There are eight councilmen on the St. Pete board, and I'm going to suggest all of you reach out to yours over there.

[00:40:25] Mark Corbett: And then, heck, you know what? Even if they're not a representative of yours, I'm going to go ahead and I'll list it on  ondick. com, but I'll also put it on Twitter. And Mat, if you wish to, you can share it as well. Those council members, and I'm not going to do anything for harassment. I'll give them what their email is for their government emails.

[00:40:44] Mark Corbett: So you can respond to them and such, but , give them your endorsement of why you think they should still, the race should have a stadi . And if there's a questions they want to ask you back, great. Let them there's, there's a couple of folks on there that had some valuable questions that I should say valid questions.

[00:41:02] Mark Corbett: And. We'll see what comes back, but I'm hoping that by November, yes, that there is a shovel in the ground. 

[00:41:10] Mat Germain: Yeah. I was interested in the doc ent you sent me. They, they had a 4. 6 percent interest as on parts of the loans.  , they had , bonds that they were, you know, using to, to finance parts of this. And , I started looking at, okay, if you, if you have 81 home games in a year, how much are you looking to bring in for it to even out to, to break even basically.

[00:41:37] Mat Germain: And it ended up being around 350, 000 that you're looking to bring in for each game. So when you look at the fans, like let's say they get about 60 or two thirds full stadi . So let's say 20, 000 A game on average, 

[00:41:53] Mark Corbett: then 

[00:41:55] Mat Germain: you're looking at, okay, well, how much is that worth to me as a city, like all the hotels, the foods, the cabs, the, you know, and now all the workers that work at the stadi , all the workers that did construction at the stadi , the idea of how much is all that economic benefit worth to me for each game.

[00:42:13] Mat Germain: And that's a really hard thing to tell. And I don't know, like, I'm still looking at it, I guess, in a little bit of a selfish. Position where if I was a city like in this position, I would still be asking for at least a portion of the naming rights so that it lowers that economic necessity that I need to cover my lot my payments each year, which I think when they noted it was about 22.

[00:42:42] Mat Germain: What was it? 22 million on average per year on the debt. And then it was 29 million was the max. So you're looking at, you know, if you can cover the more you can cover of that with money coming in, the better off you are and the less likely you are to run into issues. When I look at Atlanta, what they're saying, their economic benefit is for their stadi  is about 11 million.

[00:43:07] Mat Germain: a year. So you're really looking to fill that other 17 million with things that you can't really account for, right?  , or again, in this case, maybe 11 million, if you're looking on the average. So that's why I say if they were able to get, let's say, a stadi  naming rights deal that was 18Million or 15Million a year, depending on how inflation is working for stadi  naming rights.

[00:43:30] Mat Germain: Now, I have no idea how that's working, but if you were able to get that and you say, okay, well, we'll take 60 percent and you get 40 percent like, in terms of the city gets 60 percent of that, it would actually. To me, it would make all of the people that are getting , upset about the, the, the money that coming from the public , to fund this, it would, it would kind of calm some of their fears down because they would be getting that money directly to pay for programs that that money would have may have otherwise being be used for , so I, I still feel like that should be part of it.

[00:44:11] Mat Germain:  , now I know everybody's going to say, okay, well, stew's a billion. Well, he's not, he's actually worth 800Million dollars. He's a billionaire.  , and that's 1 of the major reasons why he needs a strong partnership with the city in order to get this deal done because he doesn't have.  , the liquid assets or money to to do it on his own.

[00:44:31] Mat Germain:  , so, yeah, it's. It's a weird situation, but I still feel like the naming rights is the one avenue, I think, that could appeal to a lot of fans that are , still weighing it, like you're saying, like, in terms of wanting to support it or not. And councillors, council members, I have no idea. If , if that's weighing on them at all, or if they're just willing to accept it as it is right now, 

[00:44:56] Mark Corbett: well, there, there's some, they're going to ask for something.

[00:44:58] Mark Corbett: I did see some who were talking about the naming rights and, and getting a piece of that action. And I think it's great. You'll go ahead. There should, there should still be some dialogue, but you know, a decision does have to be made. I kind of tell you, you know, Karen, I had been traveling a little bit this year and we'd like to get a hotel near the ballpark.

[00:45:17] Mark Corbett: Right now, just for grins and giggles, while we're talking, I looked here, seeing, okay, what would it be to see a Hilton at the battery Atlanta, I get up there around say June 14th, June 15th. I think the rays are playing around then in 571 a night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see a whole price line has some for 635 and I was seeing some the other day for like practically a thousand.

[00:45:45] Mark Corbett: Yeah. So, you know, there's money that can go back into a community. What kind of 

[00:45:52] Mat Germain: palaces are you looking at, Mark? What is included in here? Are you getting massages? Are you getting meals? 

[00:45:59] Mark Corbett: What's, you would hope, wouldn't you? Jeez, my knees, dude. Let's see. That's a double tree suites. You know, that's , that's , nothing fancy.

[00:46:08] Mark Corbett: Oh, what's this one? 1, 131. That's the Omni hotel at the Battery. And what am I going to get there? Let's take a look. Oh, well, I guess so. It's, it's only, it's a four star hotel with  , four and a half stars and yeah, that's, that's just insane. I don't care what some of these places we go to like have a great view of the park.

[00:46:32] Mark Corbett: And this one does too. That's one of the things we pay for when we, we, we do spend a little bit more money here or there, but I'm sorry, a thousand bucks a month. You ain't getting it to see what I could get a seat in the park for , you know, for a couple of hundred dollars, a hundred dollars, whatever.

[00:46:47] Mark Corbett: Depending on where I sit at, but geez, man, if they can get a thousand dollars at that Omni hotel, looking at, at the battery park there, what do you think the race could do? What do you think that they could generate? 

[00:47:00] Mat Germain: Well, I think that's the genius of the proposal they've made where. From what I understand, a lot of the areas of the stadi  are going to be open seven days a week, like in terms of the concourse.

[00:47:11] Mat Germain:  , and the, the area itself is going to benefit from that because it's not going to be just about the baseball. It's also going to be about events and other , Usage , that's done there in, in the area because they are open. Like to me, that's, that's the fallacy of the stadi  things that they've done in other cities.

[00:47:32] Mat Germain: So for example, because I'm from Montreal, I'll use this as, as the go to thing, but the Olympic stadi  had literally nothing, it looked like a. Like a closed walnut when you went around it, right? And then when there was no, no baseball, it just basically had nothing around it. Just low rise , two, three story , apartments.

[00:47:56] Mat Germain: And then beyond that, you know, if you went far enough, you might be able to find a half decent restaurant.  , so. You can't have it like that. They did in the same problem was was plaguing the Rogers Center for a while in Toronto, where yes, they were close to the financial sector, but there wasn't really much built up around it.

[00:48:14] Mat Germain: Now they're developing the waterfront. They're doing a lot of things in Toronto. That's helping boost that traffic.  , so they've, you know, there's renovations, there's new stadi  ideas. I think the Rays are hitting the right thing, especially in Florida in an environment where people like to be outdoors and kind of, you know, walking around and making it more of a busy site.

[00:48:36] Mat Germain: And I don't, did you notice the skate park in there? 

[00:48:40] Mark Corbett: Yeah, 

[00:48:41] Mat Germain: man, the city connect is is is in full glory. And to me, that's a really interesting part of it as well. The, the fact that the razor, including youth, right? Because it's never an old man's game to be on the skateboard. But the fact that are including the young generation tells me they're making this area a little bit more of a hipster kind of, you know.

[00:49:03] Mat Germain: Fun, easygoing kind of , come and hang out and watch the, what people can do on skateboards, have some good food and , it's just interesting overall. I think if it does come to fruition, you know, the kinds of, of things in businesses that could come out of that because it's a little bit more of a trendy area than St.

[00:49:25] Mat Germain: Pete would otherwise have. 

[00:49:28] Mark Corbett: Well, I'm looking forward to it. I know that much. I think it's going to be a lot of fun. I think it's going to work out and I'll still post the names of those folks that the council members so you can encourage them to if you wish to go ahead and vote. Yes. On getting all of this done.

[00:49:45] Mark Corbett: And like I said, I'm sure there's things that still need to be negotiated. That's fine. But come on, guys, I'm, I'm tired of people asking me. So where are you going to build your own stadi  at least? I hopefully I won't be saying Nashville. So , I still 

[00:50:02] Mat Germain: can get their own team and bid against others and win it outright.

[00:50:06] Mat Germain: Right. There 

[00:50:06] Mark Corbett: you go, brother. There you go.   , any other things we should cover here today, Mat? 

[00:50:15] Mat Germain:  , there's a few promotions starting to come in and the minors , and, and they're starting to make things pretty interesting. So Trey Morgan was moved up from a ball to a plus.  , and what's interesting about that is he plays first base and so does Xavier Isaac that's on that team.

[00:50:32] Mat Germain: So I think there's a possibility he moves up to double A soon. I don't know exactly when , but I imagine they both, they want both of those guys to get some work at first base steadily. I don't know, I could be wrong. Maybe they're looking at Trey at another position that I haven't seen yet. But he's a really, really fun bat.

[00:50:51] Mat Germain:  , he's a lot of some people are comparing him to James Loney because he hasn't shown the power yet and he does have the hit tool that James had and some speed also to work with. So , it'll be interesting to see. His first game, he was outstanding. He had two doubles , and the whole roster, I think they put up 14 runs.

[00:51:14] Mat Germain: So the, they kind of like the addition of Trey Morgan, let's just say, and, and, but I think you're going to see more and more and more promotions. There was another one where Patrick Wicklander ended up moving up the triple A. So you're starting to see a lot more promotions trickling in.  , and I think it's going to be a fun time to kind of see, because now they're getting the roster set for eventually having the draft and the draft people going, coming into the FCL and everything gets moved up because of that.

[00:51:39] Mat Germain: Right. So, but it's kind of fun. And the other thing I would say is within the next 10 days, I predict the Rays will make a trade. So I'm, I'm feeling the vibes that something is going to shift , because I, I feel like Junior Caminero is going to come up either then or soon after then, and they're going to need to make some room.

[00:52:00] Mat Germain: And I think they're ready to make that move , as soon as they identify a willing partner and target. And I think like we're, 12 days of that. 

[00:52:10] Mark Corbett: What do you think it might be that we send out , Ramirez, Ramirez, Siri? 

[00:52:15] Mat Germain: I really think it's Harold Ramirez , just because the, the, the Rays need to build the roster to be more resilient against right handed pitching.

[00:52:23] Mat Germain: And right now it's, it's missing that they need another left handed bat. And, and Harold Ramirez, I really like him. I think he can hit against both sides of the plate to a certain degree, but he lacks the power. Against right handers and the Rays really do need that. So , unfortunately I think it'll be him.

[00:52:41] Mat Germain: And I think they're going to want everyday playing time for junior Cameron arrow when he comes up. So as soon as you do that, it, it really restricts the amount of at bats you can give everybody else.  , there's an off chance that it could be Jose Siri as well.  , or instead of Harold.  , especially with the, you know, the benchings that have happened overall.

[00:53:03] Mat Germain:  , but I think his ability to cover center field and the speed that he gives them off the bench, if Johnny DeLuca does get most of the playing time. I think that keeps Jose Siri a little bit safe.  , but you never know. Could be either, or I would predict one of those two. 

[00:53:17] Mark Corbett: Well, it's like everything else we get a player.

[00:53:19] Mark Corbett: We like, even if the performance isn't, you know, enough to keep them and we follow them, I, I know earlier today I was watching a bit of who was, I think, the Phillies in the Mets, and I see the guy up the plate and said, Hmm, I don't even have to look too close to see that it was the way that fellas squatted at the plate.

[00:53:37] Mark Corbett: I said, that is Joey Wendell , 

[00:53:41] Mat Germain:  , bare hand, Wendell . 

[00:53:42] Mark Corbett: That's it, brother. That's it. Yes, but I, I love following our, our x-rays as well, but well. I can't thank you enough, Mat, for especially bringing up everything's going on with the promotions in the minor leagues. I folks, well, you know, Mat says it and I say it all the time, check out the minor league teams.

[00:54:02] Mark Corbett: Cause there's so much action going on. You know, we're not saying you had to be there at the Durham bulls. You got the biscuits, you've got them good. You've got the hot rods and what's the, who's the, forgive me. I forgot the other one, the river dogs, the Charleston river dogs. Yeah, man. And , all of those.

[00:54:19] Mark Corbett: So make sure you get out there, get a chance to see him because those games are as exciting as the rest, as far as I'm concerned. 

[00:54:25] Mat Germain: Absolutely. You get to see where guys come from and how much they grow over time. So to me, that's the most interesting part. 

[00:54:32] Mark Corbett: Hey, I want to leave you with another one too, man. I keep throwing one more ball.

[00:54:37] Mark Corbett: You keep failing them off on me. No , geez, I had , had Mickey might linger on the show the other day. And she's a woman who's playing with the USA, you know, women's baseball team, and she'll be going over to Thunder Bay with them and see if in July, but what's really cool about her is she's doing some work with kids like in Uganda, Uganda, excuse me, and helping them with baseball.

[00:55:04] Mark Corbett: She was working. With another part of her skills, she's an architect. She told me she's building, building some ballparks too. I said, we need you. I said, well, she's a pitcher. I said, so tell me. Are you making sure that you don't have the bullpen out in the middle of the field? 

[00:55:24] Mat Germain: You know what? That's a very curious thing though.

[00:55:26] Mat Germain: Cause I've never even considered it. Like who has designed ballparks to this point? Has it been a really male dominated thing or is there more input from, from women overall? Like, I don't know. And then how different would it be if it, if it's both right. Or has it been, if it has happened, I don't know. I don't follow stadi  architecture.

[00:55:49] Mat Germain: But I, I would imagine that the more perspectives you have when you're building a stadi , the better off it's going to be for everyone. 

[00:55:55] Mark Corbett: She said, pitching tunnels. And I didn't ask her to expound on it. I think I'm gonna have her back on just to talk about the architecture of ballparks and nothing else about baseball.

[00:56:05] Mark Corbett: Cause it's fascinating, but nonetheless. 

[00:56:08] Mat Germain: Yeah. Yeah. So right now the rays are , are down to one to Boston. So hopefully by the time that , the night finishes, the, the rays are able to add runs and get. Get the W tonight. I'm hoping they take three of four in a series. I think they can take the game tomorrow.

[00:56:26] Mat Germain: So I'm looking at this one , with very, very, very close attention. 

[00:56:31] Mark Corbett: All right. We definitely want to see Taj do well and the rest of the guys come and staying strong with the offense. So it was another Ray's petition of   on deck. I'm Mark carbon. And of course that's Mr. Mat Jermaine and Mat, once again, thank you, buddy, for being here and putting some enlightenment to all the rest of us Rays fans.

[00:56:50] Mat Germain: Always appreciate it, Mark. Always love it. 

[00:56:53] Mark Corbett: All right. That's Mr. Mat. Jermaine. Again, you can find Mat on Twitter at Mat M A T underscore Jermaine G E R M A I N underscore. Mat_Germain_  Okay. Thanks again, everybody for joining us here today. And we look forward to talking to you again real soon. Just remember you can find us on Apple podcasts, iHeartRadio, YouTube, YouTube music, Pandora, Amazon music, and of course here, and also on  www.baseballbizondeck.com Please go ahead and love us, like us, like I said, and leave your reviews. Also want to leave special thanks to XtakeRUX for the music rocking forward.

Special Thanks to Colleen Wright of the Tampa Bay Times who has kept the community apprised of the ongoing discussions between The Tampa Bay Rays & the City of St. Pete.